We own EVs. Ask Us Anything.

[J Alynn]

I mean, if they need someone to run a couple of 10,000 mile road trips in a pre-production vehicle, I’d be happy to do it. I’d even bring it back at the end of the trip.

Fully charged I’m sure

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

Fully charged I’m sure

Oh, absolutely.

 

[nolen]

ABRP is super conservative and doesn’t include overnight charging on L2 unless you purposefully plan it. I’ve found it’s inaccurate for all but the shortest drives (i.e., if you have more than one or two charge stops, it isn’t very accurate).

is there one you recommend? I'm still trying to figure out what to do as the clock ticks down on the tax credits. Found out today that our co-op also gives a rebate if you buy an EV and that we live in a federally defined low income area so we would qualify for $1000 credit on a level 2 charger (assuming that one is still usable)

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

is there one you recommend? I'm still trying to figure out what to do as the clock ticks down on the tax credits. Found out today that our co-op also gives a rebate if you buy an EV and that we live in a federally defined low income area so we would qualify for $1000 credit on a level 2 charger (assuming that one is still usable)

I think ABRP is a good start for planning. I just don’t take it too literally. It helps to see some of your charging options. And it’s good to use to determine if your hoped-for-route will have the charging you need.

If I’m going to a new place a long distance (more than a day drive) away, I might also use Plugshare. It has a rudimentary route planning option, but I don’t use that. I just check to see if there are more than one charge option in the areas I might consider stopping.

Most of the time when we’re going for a drive that’s new but not more than a fill-up or two away, we just go. When it’s about time to start thinking about a stop, we ask Google or we ask the internal navigation app on the vehicle. If those don’t work, we pull up Electrify America or another app on our phones to look for chargers. We’ve never had trouble finding several chargers within easy range.

 

[dreamweaver]

Fully charged I’m sure

It is the polite thing to do.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

I meant to add that abrp doesn't have a good way to set a daily drive limit or to add overnight L2 stops to charge to 100%. You can fudge it, but it won't do it automatically. So abrp can add hours to a longer road trip unnecessarily. It's fine for one day at a time planning and okay for longer overview mapping.

 

[Coyle70]

Here’s a question?
I was told by someone who knows someone blah blah
That when they use wiper blades in their model3 that’s when the get the biggest loss in range.
Any truth or notice on other EVs?

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

Here’s a question?
I was told by someone who knows someone blah blah
That when they use wiper blades in their model3 that’s when the get the biggest loss in range.
Any truth or notice on other EVs?

Wait. Are you serious? Is that a thing?

 

[LastDayScout]

Here’s a question?
I was told by someone who knows someone blah blah
That when they use wiper blades in their model3 that’s when the get the biggest loss in range.
Any truth or notice on other EVs?

I previously owned 2 and never experienced that. Now, a possibility is that the rain/water makes for a reduction in range. The water makes for more rolling resistance. Maybe they just thought it’s the wipers because you’re using them when it rains.

 

[cyure]

I have another question. I just updated my iPhone to the latest OS and it’s quite different. When you get over the air updates to your cars do they give you advanced warning when it’s coming and what will be in it and how to operate the new changes. This new update was quite different on this phone and it made me think about that. Thanks!!

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

I have another question. I just updated my iPhone to the latest OS and it’s quite different. When you get over the air updates to your cars do they give you advanced warning when it’s coming and what will be in it and how to operate the new changes. This new update was quite different on this phone and it made me think about that. Thanks!!

That’s going to be a manufacturer-specific answer, just like Android vs iOS comes with very different update expectations and alerts.

Ford doesn’t provide great release notes. But in the ~4 years of ownership, Ford hasn’t made major changes to its UI/UX—for better or for worse, depending on your opinions of its UI/UX.

 

[Coyle70]

Wait. Are you serious? Is that a thing?

Apparently but not knowing you start to wonder resistance =more power not totally bizarre to those who have no reference

 

[Coyle70]

Wait. Are you serious?

Apparently but not knowing you start to wonder resistance =more power not totally bizarre to those who have no reference

if you work with generators you know that more load more fuel

Resistance = load

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

Apparently but not knowing you start to wonder resistance =more power not totally bizarre to those who have no reference

Physics-wise, it makes no sense to me. Seems like someone’s pulling someone’s leg.

 

[oldgeeksguide]

Physics-wise, it makes no sense to me. Seems like someone’s pulling someone’s leg.

Yeah, the only thing that could make sense is that the range is effected by rainy weather, but I expect leg pulling is the more likely explanation.

 

[Chavannigans]

Apparently but not knowing you start to wonder resistance =more power not totally bizarre to those who have no reference

When you’re driving in the rain you’re pushing a tiny wave in front of each tire which increases rolling resistance.

I’m sure the wiper motor(s) have their own draw, and activate the headlights that also have more draw.

The rain also affects aerodynamics.

But all of those things adding a significant amount of range loss is wild.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

When you’re driving in the rain you’re pushing a tiny wave in front of each tire which increases rolling resistance.

I’m sure the wiper motor(s) have their own draw, and activate the headlights that also have more draw.

The rain also affects aerodynamics.

But all of those things adding a significant amount of range loss is wild.

I had taken the statement to mean that they thought that the biggest impact was wiper motors, not the biggest impact is rain. While the latter often necessitates the former, the wiper motors can be on without there being any rain—I knew a kid in high school who always drove with the wiper motors on. Very bizarre.

I discount the energy costs of wiper motor, headlights, etc. With modern vehicles, those are minimally impactful. I can even go out to measure it in the truck if needed.

Rain in the air impact on aerodynamics has only a couple percent impact on automobile drag (so overall not a large percent on total range). Though we get soaked during a rainstorm, the relative density of the air doesn’t change a lot, and the mass of the rain only matters a little bit.

However, as you noted: a thin film of water on the road will absolutely increase rolling resistance. It will depend a bit on the tire tread. Here’s one example from a research paper where they did experiments on the roads in Poland and Sweden.

You can see that for an 80 kph test, at about 0.65-0.7 mm of rain on the road surface, the rolling resistance is increased by about 40%. It gets even higher at higher speeds. This is in part due to the vehicle pushing water as you mentioned. It’s also because the tire temperature is decreased and that causes lower pressure and thus increased rolling resistance. This is just rolling resistance. This impact will be more noticeable at low speeds since rolling resistance has a greater relative effect on efficiency at low speeds. At higher speeds, drag takes over.

Humidity doesn’t have a large impact on aerodynamic drag; this is mostly because high humidity air tends to be warmer air and density is more dependent on temperature than humidity, so highly humid air tends to be less dense.

Overall, for an EV, on a no-HVAC drive, something like >95% of the energy gets to the driveline (as opposed to ICEs, which lose about 79% of the energy to heating up the surroundings without producing useful work). Driveline losses cost about 2% - 5%. So about 90% of the energy is delivered to the wheels.

On the highway, about 45%-50% of the total energy expenditure is spent on pushing the air out of the way. If there’s a 4% increase in aerodynamic drag due to rain, that’s a 2% increase in total energy expenditure. 350 miles * 0.02 = 7 miles reduction in range.

For rolling resistance, at highway speeds, about 15% of the total energy expended is due to rolling resistance. If that increases by 50%, that’s another 7%-8% increase in total energy expense, which is about 28 miles reduction in range assuming 350 miles range.


Reducing speed a bit will overcome most or all of that increase in resistance.

 

[dreamweaver]

I had taken the statement to mean that they thought that the biggest impact was wiper motors, not the biggest impact is rain. While the latter often necessitates the former, the wiper motors can be on without there being any rain—I knew a kid in high school who always drove with the wiper motors on. Very bizarre.

I discount the energy costs of wiper motor, headlights, etc. With modern vehicles, those are minimally impactful. I can even go out to measure it in the truck if needed.

Rain in the air impact on aerodynamics has only a couple percent impact on automobile drag (so overall not a large percent on total range). Though we get soaked during a rainstorm, the relative density of the air doesn’t change a lot, and the mass of the rain only matters a little bit.

However, as you noted: a thin film of water on the road will absolutely increase rolling resistance. It will depend a bit on the tire tread. Here’s one example from a research paper where they did experiments on the roads in Poland and Sweden.

You can see that for an 80 kph test, at about 0.65-0.7 mm of rain on the road surface, the rolling resistance is increased by about 40%. It gets even higher at higher speeds. This is in part due to the vehicle pushing water as you mentioned. It’s also because the tire temperature is decreased and that causes lower pressure and thus increased rolling resistance. This is just rolling resistance. This impact will be more noticeable at low speeds since rolling resistance has a greater relative effect on efficiency at low speeds. At higher speeds, drag takes over.

View attachment 9096

Humidity doesn’t have a large impact on aerodynamic drag; this is mostly because high humidity air tends to be warmer air and density is more dependent on temperature than humidity, so highly humid air tends to be less dense.

Overall, for an EV, on a no-HVAC drive, something like >95% of the energy gets to the driveline (as opposed to ICEs, which lose about 79% of the energy to heating up the surroundings without producing useful work). Driveline losses cost about 2% - 5%. So about 90% of the energy is delivered to the wheels.

On the highway, about 45%-50% of the total energy expenditure is spent on pushing the air out of the way. If there’s a 4% increase in aerodynamic drag due to rain, that’s a 2% increase in total energy expenditure. 350 miles * 0.02 = 7 miles reduction in range.

For rolling resistance, at highway speeds, about 15% of the total energy expended is due to rolling resistance. If that increases by 50%, that’s another 7%-8% increase in total energy expense, which is about 28 miles reduction in range assuming 350 miles range.


Reducing speed a bit will overcome most or all of that increase in resistance.

I love it when you take us to school.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

I’m changing up the bed configuration of the Lightning. Going from a tonneau cover to a cap. We get more space and more solar panel mounting space, so it’s win-win-win.

To do that, I decided to wash the bed after removing the tonneau cover. But I wanted to use the pressure washer and the hose location is too far from an outlet in the workshop and I didn’t want to run an extension cord. Fortunately the truck has plenty of electric power to run a pressure washer.

 

[Chavannigans]

I’m changing up the bed configuration of the Lightning. Going from a tonneau cover to a cap. We get more space and more solar panel mounting space, so it’s win-win-win.

To do that, I decided to wash the bed after removing the tonneau cover. But I wanted to use the pressure washer and the hose location is too far from an outlet in the workshop and I didn’t want to run an extension cord. Fortunately the truck has plenty of electric power to run a pressure washer.

View attachment 9109

I approve of this flex