Are you OK with Scout vehicles starting under $60K?

[J Alynn]

All entirely fair. I definitely don't begrudge anyone who buys a car more emotionally than I do (or for really any reason; it's their money). There will always be emotion in a purchase of that size, even for people like me and your wife, I just try my best to minimize it.

Part of the issue with comparisons among EVs is just the size of the market. R2, iX3, and Traveler are certainly not equal in all aspects, but there are very limited midsize SUVs in the EV market. The new Jeep Recon is the closest thing to the Traveler, but I'd never buy anything Stellantis except maybe a used Wrangler (plus the range on it is a nonstarter for me). Hopefully over the next decade we'll see a lot more options to where there aren't these niches that only have one car in them.

And as you noted, but I do want to emphasize.. I certainly understand Scout charging more than the R2 is supposed to cost. Every company has to find the balance between features and cost. They might have just found a balance that's a little too rich for my blood. We'll see, though. I love the car and pretty much everything about it. I wish I was uber rich and didn't have to make these choices lol.

Can’t argue with that-my wife really likes the Rivians and I have her looking at the R2. Won’t be a rush but she likes the look. Shes also intrigued with the Audi version of the Scout. She’s always wanted an Audi but we’ve never had a good experience at our local dealerships so she’s never pulled the trigger. She works hard and is our bread winner so kinda hoping she likes them and treats herself

 

[cyure]

Can’t argue with my wife really likes the Rivians and I have her looking at the R2. Won’t be a rush but she likes the look. Shes also intrigued with the Audi version of the Scout. She’s always wanted an Audi but we’ve never had a good experience at our local dealerships so she’s never pulled the trigger. She works hard and is our bread winner so kinda hoping she likes them and treats herself

As she should. How close is a Rivian Spaces? They let you take them for 45 minute test drives.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

I evaluate total cost of ownership (TCO) rather than purchase price.

If the value proposition of the Scout Traveler BEV is such that it will provide better value in 5-15 years than any other similar vehicle, then it will make it to the top of the short list. If it’s going to be expensive just to be expensive, then I will likely place it lower in the short list or it may drop off.

A lot of people on here see value in things like appearance and styling. I don’t put a lot of weight into those things. I understand that people have those preferences and don’t begrudge them. But if the interior won’t survive me, it doesn’t matter how good it looks on the showroom floor. I don’t care if it’s ugly; I care if it’s functional. If it’s some expensive material that can’t handle me sitting down with a mutlitool in my back pocket, or my pants seat covered in mud, then it isn’t for me.

Since I’ll be comparing an already-owned BEV with the Scout, Scout will have a lot of work to do to convince me that it’s worth the upfront cost. If, for example, its efficiency is much lower than the BEV we already own, or it requires the purchase of a new L2 charger (because they make the mistake of not ensuring backward compatibility with existing chargers), or some other thing comes up that means I’ll be spending even more for the Scout, then we may chose not to purchase.

So, the question for me isn’t the out-the-door price. It’s the total cost to own the vehicle for 5-15 years.

 

[oldgeeksguide]

As one of only two current "yes" votes, I would like to offer some countervailing thoughts. And this ended up much longer than I planned..

I understand everyone here is inherently enthusiastic about the car, and I am too, but when it comes time to spend $60k on a car, I will be putting my emotions out of the picture. I will be evaluating this car on its merits at the time of my purchase. And there are a couple hard realities.

One, $60k is a lot of money. I can afford it, sure, but that doesn't change the fact it's a lot of money that could be better spent. I've never spent that much on a car and really don't plan on it unless it offers some crazy value for my money or has some sort of set of features that I need. I don't do any offroading except for the occasional dirt road at a campsite. I, like many Americans, am someone who likes the idea of having offroad capabilities but don't really need them if I'm being honest with myself. The kind of roads I've gone down my Explorer has handled just fine. I don't really need locking differentials or a solid axle, as cool as I think they are.

Two, there could be competitors that will do similar things for less or similar money. Namely, the R2 and the iX3. And those are just the two I know about that will be out before the Traveler. That means availability for those will likely be far greater when I go to make my next car purchase. BEVs have horrible depreciation schedules, so buying a year or two used is the superior value proposition. I could buy a formerly-$65k iX3 in 2028 for maybe $40k or even a formerly-$50k R2 for something like $30k. That means a brand new (if I can even get one) Scout in 2028 for $60k would have to offer me better value, which I don't think is happening. And even if I wanted to buy new, discounts on readily-available R2s and iX3s may be more readily available.

Three, there are other compounding factors having to do with buying a brand-new vehicle from a brand-new company. While I don’t expect Scout, with VW’s backing, to have the same issues that, say, Rivian had when they first launched, I do expect there to be growing pains. The old adage of never buying the first model year of a car would hold especially true when that was the first car the company ever made. Not to mention, service centers are going to be an issue right off the bat. I live in a major city, but not a city that’s so big that it’ll certainly be in the first wave of service centers. Maybe I’d overlook all that at a lower price, but not at $60k.

You'll notice that some of this reasoning isn't wholly about the price. I can't look at a vehicle purchase and say that there's one deciding factor I use to determine what I get. But at the end of the day, if the Scouts were cheaper, I'd be much more likely to buy one when they first arrive. Since that's the crux of the question presented, I voted "yes."

I would be very tempted by the r2 if it weren’t for their anti-button aesthetic. Wassym leans heavily toward the minimalist Tesla style, which I don’t care for. But the r2 is a more appropriate size for my needs. I’m hoping that a similar scout model will come along before I’m too old to drive it.

Plus if I did a factory pick up I could get a gondola at Avantis and meet @cyure

 

[speedrye]

I think "with the spare" is doing a lot of heavy lifting there lol. Without the spare, it's about 10" shorter than the R1S. I'm not sure what the logic would be to include the size of the spare when determining class of vehicle. You could throw a hitch-mounted spare on the R1S and make it much longer. Although, I would concede it's tough putting the Traveler in the same class as the R2 and iX3. The latter two are on the smaller side of the "midsize" class, while the Traveler would be on the bigger side. The Traveler is similar in size to my Explorer, which is quintessential "midsize" and is tiny next to an Expedition.


It's only 1" wider than the Explorer, but Explorer is 8" longer. I haven't seen the Traveler in person, so I'm just going by the actual dimensions. Maybe it does seem bigger in person. And not that it has to be determinative, but every full-size class SUV I can think of has three rows.

Definitely true, but as someone that drives a vehicle with a 35" tire hanging off the back, it's definitely something to factor in when parking or making decisions about whether a vehicle can fit in your garage. I haven't even paid attention, is the carrier on the rear optional?

 

[cyure]

Definitely true, but as someone that drives a vehicle with a 35" tire hanging off the back, it's definitely something to factor in when parking or making decisions about whether a vehicle can fit in your garage. I haven't even paid attention, is the carrier on the rear optional?

We don’t have an answer to exactly what that will look like yet. Is it optional, removable. We just don’t know yet.

 

[J Alynn]

Definitely true, but as someone that drives a vehicle with a 35" tire hanging off the back, it's definitely something to factor in when parking or making decisions about whether a vehicle can fit in your garage. I haven't even paid attention, is the carrier on the rear optional?

It was essentially noted at the reveal that it would be an option

 

[cyure]

It was essentially noted at the reveal that it would be an option

We just don’t know if that means purchase with it on or off or removable.

 

[R1TVT]

A lot of people on here see value in things like appearance and styling. I don’t put a lot of weight into those things. I understand that people have those preferences and don’t begrudge them. But if the interior won’t survive me, it doesn’t matter how good it looks on the showroom floor. I don’t care if it’s ugly

Did you consider a CT? ;-)

 

[pwrofgrayskull]

I must be out of the loop because I’ve never seen so much talk about removing a rear mounted spare tire before. Maybe I’ve missed it, but I haven’t come across people talking about it over the years on Wranglers, G Wagens, Broncos, Defenders, RAV4s, etc., etc., or even back when I had my FJ Cruiser. I’ve just never seen discussions about that before and there have been many vehicles with rear mounted spares over the years. I can see the reasons some people bring up and it makes sense for their situations, I just wonder why I haven’t noticed this with other vehicles. Perhaps this is one of the longest vehicles ever with a rear mounted spare tire? I haven’t checked dimensions to compare with those other vehicles, but maybe that’s part of it. With the Jeeps I usually only see someone delete the spare when they go to 40 inch or bigger tires.

Anyway, just some random thoughts in my morning head here. I love the look with the spare on the Traveler and for me I would not want to delete it. I even liked that Terra picture where someone simulated the rear mounted spare, looked good. With that said, I swear I watched a video on the Traveler at some point and the guy talking was pointing out the hinge system and calling it a removable hinge pin for times when you want to remove the spare and carrier. Now, whether that’s true or not I have no clue. I have seen so, so, so much incorrect information on the Scouts out there in video and print that he very well could have been talking out of his exhaust pipe.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

Did you consider a CT? ;-)

Only if I ever end up homeless and need a dumpster to sleep in.

 

[R1TVT]

I think "with the spare" is doing a lot of heavy lifting there lol. Without the spare, it's about 10" shorter than the R1S. I'm not sure what the logic would be to include the size of the spare when determining class of vehicle. You could throw a hitch-mounted spare on the R1S and make it much longer. Although, I would concede it's tough putting the Traveler in the same class as the R2 and iX3. The latter two are on the smaller side of the "midsize" class, while the Traveler would be on the bigger side. The Traveler is similar in size to my Explorer, which is quintessential "midsize" and is tiny next to an Expedition.


It's only 1" wider than the Explorer, but Explorer is 8" longer. I haven't seen the Traveler in person, so I'm just going by the actual dimensions. Maybe it does seem bigger in person. And not that it has to be determinative, but every full-size class SUV I can think of has three rows.

I have to say, I think this is one of those places where the Scout Traveler very intentionally fits into a window between the R1S and the R2 for some buyers...

The Traveler (at least to me) seems much more aligned with the attributes and capabilities (and footprint) of the R1, but without a 3rd row making it shorter, but also with a full-sized spare. This says to me that Rivian (with the R1S) was going for a little different / perhaps more family-oriented adventure audience, and the the Traveler is more intentionally designed to be rugged and outdoorsy, but makes no apologies for not having a 3rd row - for a reason.

The R2 is also Rivian's first foray into a "mass-market" and more value-oriented market (with a lot of the tech and capability we saw out of the gate with the R1) that will drive unit sales and more profitibility.

The R2 just doesn't map directly to the Traveler, and the Traveler doesn't map perfectly to the R1. Will be really interested in seeing buyer demographics and sales for these vehicles. There is clearly a place for all of them - the battle for marketshare & competition will help all of them.

 

[cyure]

I must be out of the loop because I’ve never seen so much talk about removing a rear mounted spare tire before. Maybe I’ve missed it, but I haven’t come across people talking about it over the years on Wranglers, G Wagens, Broncos, Defenders, RAV4s, etc., etc., or even back when I had my FJ Cruiser. I’ve just never seen discussions about that before and there have been many vehicles with rear mounted spares over the years. I can see the reasons some people bring up and it makes sense for their situations, I just wonder why I haven’t noticed this with other vehicles. Perhaps this is one of the longest vehicles ever with a rear mounted spare tire? I haven’t checked dimensions to compare with those other vehicles, but maybe that’s part of it. With the Jeeps I usually only see someone delete the spare when they go to 40 inch or bigger tires.

Anyway, just some random thoughts in my morning head here. I love the look with the spare on the Traveler and for me I would not want to delete it. I even liked that Terra picture where someone simulated the rear mounted spare, looked good. With that said, I swear I watched a video on the Traveler at some point and the guy talking was pointing out the hinge system and calling it a removable hinge pin for times when you want to remove the spare and carrier. Now, whether that’s true or not I have no clue. I have seen so, so, so much incorrect information on the Scouts out there in video and print that he very well could have been talking out of his exhaust pipe.

Same. Being a Wrangler owner it never even dawned on me that people would ask to remove the spare tire carrier. I didn’t think that was a thing.

I am 100% leaving that tire carrier on. Like would have fit if I couldn’t get my tire carrier.

 

[pwrofgrayskull]

Only if I ever end up homeless and need a dumpster to sleep in.

My goodness.

 

[pwrofgrayskull]

I have to say, I think this is one of those places where the Scout Traveler very intentionally fits into a window between the R1S and the R2 for some buyers...

The Traveler (at least to me) seems much more aligned with the attributes and capabilities (and footprint) of the R1, but without a 3rd row making it shorter, but also with a full-sized spare. This says to me that Rivian (with the R1S) was going for a little different / perhaps more family-oriented adventure audience, and the the Traveler is more intentionally designed to be rugged and outdoorsy, but makes no apologies for not having a 3rd row - for a reason.

The R2 is also Rivian's first foray into a "mass-market" and more value-oriented market (with a lot of the tech and capability we saw out of the gate with the R1) that will drive unit sales and more profitibility.

The R2 just doesn't map directly to the Traveler, and the Traveler doesn't map perfectly to the R1. Will be really interested in seeing buyer demographics and sales for these vehicles. There is clearly a place for all of them - the battle for marketshare & competition will help all of them.

Agreed!

 

[R1TVT]

Only if I ever end up homeless and need a dumpster to sleep in.

Well-played

 

[pwrofgrayskull]

Same. Being a Wrangler owner it never even dawned on me that people would ask to remove the spare tire carrier. I didn’t think that was a thing.

I am 100% leaving that tire carrier on. Like would have fit if I couldn’t get my tire carrier.

I feel the same way!!

 

[Chaz26]

Can’t argue with that-my wife really likes the Rivians and I have her looking at the R2. Won’t be a rush but she likes the look. Shes also intrigued with the Audi version of the Scout. She’s always wanted an Audi but we’ve never had a good experience at our local dealerships so she’s never pulled the trigger. She works hard and is our bread winner so kinda hoping she likes them and treats herself

A friend of mine likes the Audi dealer on Carlisle Pike in Mechanicsburg and got his from there. That's where I usually get my Tesla inspected as well.

 

[J Alynn]

I must be out of the loop because I’ve never seen so much talk about removing a rear mounted spare tire before. Maybe I’ve missed it, but I haven’t come across people talking about it over the years on Wranglers, G Wagens, Broncos, Defenders, RAV4s, etc., etc., or even back when I had my FJ Cruiser. I’ve just never seen discussions about that before and there have been many vehicles with rear mounted spares over the years. I can see the reasons some people bring up and it makes sense for their situations, I just wonder why I haven’t noticed this with other vehicles. Perhaps this is one of the longest vehicles ever with a rear mounted spare tire? I haven’t checked dimensions to compare with those other vehicles, but maybe that’s part of it. With the Jeeps I usually only see someone delete the spare when they go to 40 inch or bigger tires.

Anyway, just some random thoughts in my morning head here. I love the look with the spare on the Traveler and for me I would not want to delete it. I even liked that Terra picture where someone simulated the rear mounted spare, looked good. With that said, I swear I watched a video on the Traveler at some point and the guy talking was pointing out the hinge system and calling it a removable hinge pin for times when you want to remove the spare and carrier. Now, whether that’s true or not I have no clue. I have seen so, so, so much incorrect information on the Scouts out there in video and print that he very well could have been talking out of his exhaust pipe.

Until SM announces it im not buying it. But time will tell

 

[J Alynn]

A friend of mine likes the Audi dealer on Carlisle Pike in Mechanicsburg and got his from there. That's where I usually get my Tesla inspected as well.

Been by their and looped the lot a couple of times. Now that they are on their own and not part of the combo (that’s Sun automotive correct?). My in-laws are like 10 minutes from there. My cousin works for Rahal on the Pike as well so we’ve been through all the dealerships. Will need to keep in mind. I went to the Audi dealer in Reading for my TT but the sales guy retired. He was decent but didn’t care for financing dept and the other nonsense so maybe Carlisle pike is the answer when the time comes. I despise Autohaus!!!!