Extra, Extra....Read All About It!

[THil08]

I don’t recall seeing this.

https://www.thestate.com/news/local/article314652578.html

But it seems that possibly road worthy real looking Scout test vehicles will be out towards the end of the year.

 

[6-ScoutFamily]

My views on this may be different from the rest. Both politically and related to this topic.

Personally I think government shouldn’t get involved with charging infrastructure, they should work the same way how gas stations are, operated and funded by a private owner. And this has nothing to do with gas subsidies and yada yada yada that everyone will bring up to try to sound smart. We should honestly leave Tesla , Ionna, and Rivian to do the infrastructure. The whole NEVI Act was apart of (Improper Planning causes Piss Poor Performance) from day one it was a really slow roll out and didn’t go anywhere. If we leave it to Ionna, Tesla, and Rivian the infrastructure would have been huge by now (Tesla’s is already huge, Ionna is expanding quickly, and we’ll Rivian is Rivian they will get there). The government should sell what ever contracts and or land they have to Tesla, Rivian and Ionna to build on.


Also Let’s hope for a big and beautiful Rivian Earnings call tomorrow, because @cyure needs her Trader Joe’s(or what I call it) and I need my stock to bounce back.

And as on what Uncle Baby Billy would say, "God bless this cocaine(stupidity) to give me the energy to beat this demon!"

I totally agree with your viewpoint. Including the buyer tax incentives. IMO government’s hand just muddies the issue in a morass of regulation and unforeseen consequences, many of them negative. The other side of this of course is ending oil and gas subsidies. It may indeed be time to do this.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

A few years ago the concept didn't bother me as much as it does now. I love our Volvo, its a great drive, super comfortable, blah blah. But the lack of physicality in its interface drives me nuts when it comes to things like changing the temp/airflow or switching the display. It's evangelized me quite a bit and that's seeped over to things like door handles.

The idea of pop-out, electric door handles on a truck just blows my mind and not in a good way. When I’m working, say with muddy gloves on, the last thing I want to deal with is some nonsense hand gymnastics to open a door. I want to pull on the handle and have the door open. I want my gloved hand to fit into the handle. I don’t want the mud on my glove to get into the mechanism and bork it up so it stops working. I want the door just to open mechanically as I pull, not wait a brief moment while the handle shakes hands with the overlord and asks permission to open, the overlord checks with sixteen other systems to get permission to open the door, and I have to wait while they all give their “GO.”

 

[robothero]

Trying to flip an aux switch to control your winch with muddy hands but it's buried in 4 touchscreen menus.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

Trying to flip an aux switch to control your winch with muddy hands but it's buried in 4 touchscreen menus.

Exactly. “Get a touchscreen stylus,” they’ll say. Jump through sixteen hoops to accomplish the same thing a mechanical solution would solve in one step.

 

[bb00799]

I don’t recall seeing this.

https://www.thestate.com/news/local/article314652578.html

But it seems that possibly road worthy real looking Scout test vehicles will be out towards the end of the year.

This would not entirely surprise me with the rate of construction right now.. Especially if they are aiming to have production by the end of 2027.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

AND the argument that hidden door handles improve efficiency is nonsense. The truck (especially) is a brick. Removing a couple of relatively tiny bumps from a brick doesn’t make it some kind of slipstream dream. It’s still a brick.

 

[robothero]

Exactly. “Get a touchscreen stylus,” they’ll say. Jump through sixteen hoops to accomplish the same thing a mechanical solution would solve in one step.

This just reminded me of something else that grinds my gears in both of our cars.

In my subaru, I can't open the fuel door without pulling a physical switch to unlock it. I've had my car for like 8 years and still forget half the time. Annoying!

In the Volvo, its the usual push-to-open system, but if the car is locked or you don't have the keyfob with you (like its in your wifes purse which is still in the car) sometimes it won't open! This is also annoying!

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

This just reminded me of something else that grinds my gears in both of our cars.

In my subaru, I can't open the fuel door without pulling a physical switch to unlock it. I've had my car for like 8 years and still forget half the time. Annoying!

In the Volvo, its the usual push-to-open system, but if the car is locked or you don't have the keyfob with you (like its in your wifes purse which is still in the car) sometimes it won't open! This is also annoying!

Incredibly annoying. Ford just pushed an update that locks our charge port when the vehicle locks. I find that incredibly annoying and when I have time, it’ll be one of the things I hack in to disable.

The “stealing gas” problem was solved with the little flapper built inside the filler nozzle in the 1980s. Locking fuel doors or locking gas caps are no longer necessary. Also, thefts like that were a minuscule problem in the grand scheme of things.

I’m so exhausted from all of the propaganda that I must be afraid of everyone and everything. If someone stole some gas from me, they probably needed it more than I did and I’d have happily given it to them if they’d asked, but since I wasn’t around, they got what they needed and I lost little. Now I have to pay for a lock on this and a lock on that when I don’t really want any of those locks. The overall cost to me is greater than if we’d just let that “theif” have a gallon of gas.

 

[robothero]

If some of these EVs were gas vehicles you'd have to navigate through multiple touchscreens to unlock your fuel door.

 

[strider]

A few years ago the concept didn't bother me as much as it does now. I love our Volvo, its a great drive, super comfortable, blah blah. But the lack of physicality in its interface drives me nuts when it comes to things like changing the temp/airflow or switching the display. It's evangelized me quite a bit and that's seeped over to things like door handles.

This is the primary reason I am leaving Tesla. They have taken the removal of physical controls too far: no turn signal or drive control stalks, no glovebox button, the horn is a tiny capacitive button on the face of the wheel (they since "fixed" that but despite Elon saying that my car had the capability it's never been enabled), wiper control is via pressing a capacitive button on the face of the steering wheel and then scrolling a wheel to choose the wiper setting, and on and on and on.

Now in Elon's case he truly believes that the car will drive itself "in two weeks" and in that case there is no need for physical controls as the car will handle it. Any rational person knows that is BS but it is what it is.

My son was asking about a Model 3 for his first car and I said no way. I think the user interface would be dangerous for a new driver. I'm looking at an Equinox EV for him - I think GM has a good balance of physical vs touchscreen.

 

[robothero]

My son was asking about a Model 3 for his first car and I said no way. I think the user interface would be dangerous for a new driver. I'm looking at an Equinox EV for him - I think GM has a good balance of physical vs touchscreen.

This is one of my biggest issues with Teslas, something I've stated on this forum many times.

Many years ago, if you saw an old beater coming up on the highway you might thing "oh boy, here we go." Now its a Tesla.

Inexperienced drivers flock to Tesla because it "drives itself" and when they're forced to interact with their environment the green shows. Heaven forbid autopilot is unavailable and they have to navigate through busy traffic on their own.

 

[cyure]

This is the primary reason I am leaving Tesla. They have taken the removal of physical controls too far: no turn signal or drive control stalks, no glovebox button, the horn is a tiny capacitive button on the face of the wheel (they since "fixed" that but despite Elon saying that my car had the capability it's never been enabled), wiper control is via pressing a capacitive button on the face of the steering wheel and then scrolling a wheel to choose the wiper setting, and on and on and on.

Now in Elon's case he truly believes that the car will drive itself "in two weeks" and in that case there is no need for physical controls as the car will handle it. Any rational person knows that is BS but it is what it is.

My son was asking about a Model 3 for his first car and I said no way. I think the user interface would be dangerous for a new driver. I'm looking at an Equinox EV for him - I think GM has a good balance of physical vs touchscreen.

I have a feeling we are going to end up with a generation that won’t know how to “drive” without all the assistive features in a car. They definitely won’t know how to drive a manual transmission, but I think it will go further than that. It took me forever to get my son to realize there’s still a blind spot and you have to look over your shoulder too, you can’t just expect no one to be there if the car isn’t beeping a warning at you.

 

[robothero]

I think the problem is even more pronounced with adults. Kids have had technology exposure for their entire lives and are generally adaptable/quick to learn things. New-adult-drivers cause absolute chaos in "autopilot" vehicles.

 

[THil08]

I totally agree with your viewpoint. Including the buyer tax incentives. IMO government’s hand just muddies the issue in a morass of regulation and unforeseen consequences, many of them negative. The other side of this of course is ending oil and gas subsidies. It may indeed be time to do this.

And if the subsidies were to end from my research, the average price of gas would only raise about .05/gallon.

 

[robothero]

Will never forget pulling in to pick up my youngest from daycare one day and there were 3 teslas in the parking lot, all with "be patient new driver!" magnets on them, and all were scratched, dented, or suffering from more than "cosmetic damage"

Yeesh.

 

[bb00799]

And if the subsidies were to end from my research, the average price of gas would only raise about .05/gallon.

Plus we would save over $500 billion in government spending, which you gotta love the sound of (in 2022 dollars according to the IMF).

Think of all of the trains.

 

[LastDayScout]

View attachment 13474

Looks like they have revised some of the language in the FAQ section of the website.

Now it is showing both drive units will be supplied by AAM. Previously it was only the rear axle if I am not mistaken.

Well that is news to me. I thought for sure it would be Dana, Eaton or Magna in that order. My experiences with AAM axles is in 3/4-1 ton Dodge and Chevy trucks. They all ate axle seals. I know this will be totally different, but I do not like it. My opinions and experience matter 0.0%.

 

[LastDayScout]

If we can afford one, there’s a chance. We have to see them in person. On paper, the Traveler is too wide.

Clearly nobody is making an approx 70-75-inch wide BEV SUV with off-road capabilities and a useable UX/UI any time soon. We have some time to wait, so we’ll see. Maybe Toyota will recover and build the BEV Landcruiser with an actual useable interface.

But at this time I’m shopping DIY conversion kits and a 1985-1989 FJ60 (71 inches wide, 184 inches long) or ~1996 FJ80 (76 inches wide, 190 inches long) Landcruiser.

View attachment 13468

View attachment 13466

I am of the same opinion. The Scouts are too wide. Scout, please hear us! It is too wide!!!!!!!!!!

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

I am of the same opinion. The Scouts are too wide. Scout, please hear us! It is too wide!!!!!!!!!!

The off-road routes I want to take cannot be done with an 80-inch wide SUV if the mirrors are more than 5 inches wide, which is obviously not possible without removing the mirrors. This means there aren’t any existing BEV SUVs that can do those routes. And this isn’t a “kinda can’t.” One of the routes includes going through what is essentially a slot canyon. The mirrors would be knocked off and I’d probably damage the sheet metal.