Extra, Extra....Read All About It!

[6-ScoutFamily]

I think SM pays him to be here and engage all of us simpletons

No doubt! And now for a little added fawning… we are so glad you put up with us Jamie.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

Yes. Scout has an obvious edge with VW in terms of their parts bin and engineering experience and cash infusion, but it's very difficult to say that they are "further ahead" at this stage, since Rivian's birth revolved around the development of a sports car before pivoting (and since a more accurate comparison would be with quantifiable metrics - things like "converted reservations to sales", "quarterly production units" or "delivery numbers"). Being further ahead is tough, because Scout has not yet publicly started testing their pre-production units. Also - making an apples for apples comparison to this launch will likely not be possible without a pivot, a global pandemic and giant supply chain shortage. One great thing about Rivian is that it is truly a new American OEM - built from the ground up. When we call it a "success" and an "ongoing concern" may be up for the debate, but look at the likes of Lordstown, Canoo, Bollinger and Nikola. Rivian's Fleet Services are also often overlooked, and should be a growing part of their portfolio beyond AMZN.

Rivian started in 2009 and delivered their first vehicle in 2021. But let's ignore their aborted attempt at developing a hybrid vehicle between 2009 and 2011 and ignore their restart from 2011 to 2015. If you count Rivian’s start as 2015 when they received their first major investment, it still took longer for them to debut their first prototypes (2018; 3 years) than Scout. And it took six years to deliver a vehicle from that initial investment. And Rivian didn’t have to build a factory. Scout is likely to deliver in less time than it took Rivian while also building a new factory. It’s just fact, not judgement.

I’m not sure why you post so defensively of Rivian when it’s just a matter of very public timelines. I never said Rivian doesn’t build great vehicles. I never said they were a bad company. It’s simple mathematical fact to state that Rivian took longer than it’s taken Scout to get to the point Scout is today. And the explanation is clear—Scout as a company has more support and fewer barriers, as I stated.

The question was never if Rivian is a good vehicle manufacturer.

The question was whether Scout is in danger of losing customers because of their timeline. I don’t believe they are in that much danger. I wasn’t dumping on Rivian. I was using Rivian as an example of potential customer loyalty through long “slogs” between announcement, debut, and delivery.

I wasn’t attacking Rivian.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

I think SM pays him to be here and engage all of us simpletons

I haven’t encountered any simpletons.

I wish SM paid me.
I mean, not enough to put in an application (yet).
And I don’t want to move, so it would have to be a remote job.

 

[OleScout]

Scout are moving forward at a more rapid pace than Rivian did at this stage in the company, thanks in large part to VW's and Rivian’s corporate and engineering help. The issue is that the field is a bit more crowded for Scout than it was for Rivian. So Scout needs to stick to what differentiates them from all the other players. This includes style, community, and capability.

Rivian doesn’t make off-roaders. Nobody makes off-roading EVs in the US. But Scout is working toward true off-road chops.
Rivian is priced at luxury prices; Scout should be priced low enough to be affordable to the middle-class.
Rivian doesn’t have any heritage to lean on for nostalgia. Scout does and is using that to attract a lot of people who wouldn’t have looked at yet another EV pickup startup.
Rivian has also distracted itself with bicycles and robots and I fear they’re going to go down the path of madness instead of sticking with their strength, which is incredible BEVs. If the R2 doesn’t sell like hotcakes, they’re in really big trouble.

Toyota is wrapped up eating its own tail so badly that even if they get the Hilux BEV out, they probably won’t bring it to the US before 2028. Toyota isn’t a realistic threat to Scout at this time. If they decided to, they could have a BEV pickup in the US in six months and they would dominate the entire BEV truck market. But they are an incredibly conservative company and I’m convinced they just can’t move quickly enough to do that.

RAM claims they’re going to release their EREV…sometime soon? I’ll believe it when I see real people driving it.
Ford has the Lightning, the best-selling BEV pickup in the US. But they don’t have any public updates in the pike for the Lightning. They do have T3 coming sometime…?soon?
GM/Chevrolet have the Sierra/Silverado EV, which is super expensive and doesn’t seem to have captured anyone’s imagination.

Telo and Slate are in a different market from the Terra and Traveler. I think they might steal a few sales from Scout, but probably not enough to even bother accounting.

Scout is offering the most unique electrified vehicles to be announced in the past five years. And they are creating some unique emotional responses to those vehicles the likes of which we haven’t seen in a long time.

Beautifully written. Scout is in a unique position—offering a rugged, capable EV SUV that no one else in the current market is delivering. Other manufacturers may be waiting to see how successful (or unsuccessful) Scout Motors will be before committing, but by the time they react, will it be too late for them to enter the space?

Several manufacturers actually have the perfect opportunity to bring legacy nameplates back to life:

• Ram with the Ramcharger
• Toyota with the Land Cruiser
• Chevrolet with a modern K5 Blazer

For Toyota and Chevy, this would require completely rethinking their current strategy—essentially reinventing the wheel. It will also be interesting to see if Ford eventually introduces an EV or hybrid version of the Bronco.

 

[R1TVT]

Rivian started in 2009 and delivered their first vehicle in 2021. But let's ignore their aborted attempt at developing a hybrid vehicle between 2009 and 2011 and ignore their restart from 2011 to 2015. If you count Rivian’s start as 2015 when they received their first major investment, it still took longer for them to debut their first prototypes (2018; 3 years) than Scout. And it took six years to deliver a vehicle from that initial investment. And Rivian didn’t have to build a factory. Scout is likely to deliver in less time than it took Rivian while also building a new factory. It’s just fact, not judgement.

I’m not sure why you post so defensively of Rivian when it’s just a matter of very public timelines. I never said Rivian doesn’t build great vehicles. I never said they were a bad company. It’s simple mathematical fact to state that Rivian took longer than it’s taken Scout to get to the point Scout is today. And the explanation is clear—Scout as a company has more support and fewer barriers, as I stated.

The question was never if Rivian is a good vehicle manufacturer.

The question was whether Scout is in danger of losing customers because of their timeline. I don’t believe they are in that much danger. I wasn’t dumping on Rivian. I was using Rivian as an example of potential customer loyalty through long “slogs” between announcement, debut, and delivery.

I wasn’t attacking Rivian.

Thats great and everyone can have an opinion. I was offering a perspective that the comparison between the two timelines is less important (and I was providing context as to why). Also, I'm not sure why you think i thought you were attacking Rivian - I never thought that or said that. And I don't see what was defensive?

Adding another perspective that may be counter to your own should not be perceived as an attack, but rather a response. I value your perspective and agree with much of your sentiment when it comes to Scout.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

Beautifully written. Scout is in a unique position—offering a rugged, capable EV SUV that no one else in the current market is delivering. Other manufacturers may be waiting to see how successful (or unsuccessful) Scout Motors will be before committing, but by the time they react, will it be too late for them to enter the space?

Several manufacturers actually have the perfect opportunity to bring legacy nameplates back to life:

• Ram with the Ramcharger
• Toyota with the Land Cruiser
• Chevrolet with a modern K5 Blazer

For Toyota and Chevy, this would require completely rethinking their current strategy—essentially reinventing the wheel. It will also be interesting to see if Ford eventually introduces an EV or hybrid version of the Bronco.

I believe there’s lots of room in the market.

RAM could also offer a refreshed, throwback-styled Power Wagon as a BEV/EREV. That would attract the same kind of community and controversy Scout has attracted: people demanding only a V8 while others would demand a 4-motor 2000 HP monster. Can you imagine the pearl clutching and free advertising if RAM did that? But they would have to commit to a real development team and timeline instead of running rudderless and with slack sails.

Ford’s Bronco already has a (dual-venture) BEV (400 mile range) and EREV (760 mile range)…It’s only available in China, though. The ranges are using China’s standard, which seems to overestimate real-world range even more than the EPA standard does.

A BEV K5 Blazer/Jimmy would be another great offering. That would sure get all the square body fans talking. Some happy, some upset. But talking.

Toyota, Honda, and Stellantis are definitely stuck in a previous generation mindset. I hope they’ll look over at China’s expanding offerings and realize they need to buck up instead of hunker down.

A Land Cruiser BEV or a Tacoma BEV would be a very attractive vehicle to me.

 

[J Alynn]

I believe there’s lots of room in the market.

RAM could also offer a refreshed, throwback-styled Power Wagon as a BEV/EREV. That would attract the same kind of community and controversy Scout has attracted: people demanding only a V8 while others would demand a 4-motor 2000 HP monster. Can you imagine the pearl clutching and free advertising if RAM did that? But they would have to commit to a real development team and timeline instead of running rudderless and with slack sails.

Ford’s Bronco already has a (dual-venture) BEV (400 mile range) and EREV (760 mile range)…It’s only available in China, though. The ranges are using China’s standard, which seems to overestimate real-world range even more than the EPA standard does.

A BEV K5 Blazer/Jimmy would be another great offering. That would sure get all the square body fans talking. Some happy, some upset. But talking.

Toyota, Honda, and Stellantis are definitely stuck in a previous generation mindset. I hope they’ll look over at China’s expanding offerings and realize they need to buck up instead of hunker down.

A Land Cruiser BEV or a Tacoma BEV would be a very attractive vehicle to me.

I won’t buy Stellantis but a modern retro take on a BEV Power Wagon-Oooh-that miiiiight make me rethink things. I love the old power wagons. But that buyer market/demographic would be even harder to convert than Scout fans