Want a Scout. Don't want the Drama!

[tanktheram]

I think the Scout is going to be a flop. It has a group of forums to decide features and the future, it has a direct to consumer model, and it is entering into an EV market that is in decline - it spells disaster.



Make the Scout available at all VW/Audi dealers - maybe even International dealer. All these dealers are all ready geared up for High Voltage Energy vehicles.



Provide an all-gasoline version of the Scout to compete with Bronco, Wrangler/Gladiator, Tacoma, etc. VW/Audi already has excellent gasoline powertrains that would drop in place.



Decide on 3 trim levels, good better best. Give it three powertrain options; EV, Hybrid and Gas. Make it available it at VW/Audi/International Dealers. Enough with the Forum back and forth stuff.



The best selling truck in North America is the F150. The best selling EV truck? The F150. Hybrid Truck - well F150 is also up there. Why? Its available to anyone at any Ford Dealer and servicing is a breeze.



I am rooted in the International Brand, and Scout is historically a no-nonsense vehicle that got the job done. I want one, but am not sure I want the nonsense associated with the brand so far.

 

[J Alynn]

I’m not directing this to anyone specifically, but after doing some back of the napkin mask using 90% home charging compared to the most average gas price around me a Rivian R1 quad with a large pack compared to my V8 charger for one month being generous with the amount of times I had to go to the gas station. The charger would cost me $500 a month with the amount of miles I drive. And if we consider fully charging the Rivian every night with local charge rates for an entire 30 day month, it would be just under $400 public charging cost more because of how it’s set up and I get that but if you’re buying an electric vehicle, you shouldn’t be considering public charging as your main charge source because it will cost equivalent if not more than a gas car/truck

Have to agree with you on that. Based on some of my basic calcs and our electricity rate I expect to spend about 60% of what I do with 87 octane fuel

 

[RodorW]

I’m not directing this to anyone specifically, but after doing some back of the napkin mask using 90% home charging compared to the most average gas price around me a Rivian R1 quad with a large pack compared to my V8 charger for one month being generous with the amount of times I had to go to the gas station. The charger would cost me $500 a month with the amount of miles I drive. And if we consider fully charging the Rivian every night with local charge rates for an entire 30 day month, it would be just under $400 public charging cost more because of how it’s set up and I get that but if you’re buying an electric vehicle, you shouldn’t be considering public charging as your main charge source because it will cost equivalent if not more than a gas car/truck

I also feel I should add my math is 0 to 100% on the Rivian every day and half a full tank of gas from 0 to 100 in the charger twice a week I feel like I’m being very generous to the thirsty charger

 

[RodorW]

Though I do think it’ll be interesting to see the numbers after scouts release and someone gets a harvester and a all electric model and compares the difference in charging at home on all electric and charging with just using the gas generator and what the difference in cost there will be cause surely it’ll be cheaper than long-term with just a gas engine, but is there any chance it could be cheaper than charging at home?

 

[tanktheram]

I understand that home charging provides immense cost reductions and that napkins math will always show that an EV is more cost friendly.... but we're forgetting the upfront cost to buy.

For the price of a loaded Hummer or Rivian - I was able to buy a loaded dealer demo Powerwagon and a used Challenger 392 with money to spare. With the money to spare, I bought a used Egolf.

All daily activities, errands, work, etc are done in the commuter. I never use public charging. The PW is for big mountain adventures. The Chally is for hooning.

Now, we've all agreed a Scout will not be efficient, BEV, EREV or ICE. A heavy, tall, square box with big rubber. It's going to be Rivian expensive we know this by initial estimates. So, you could buy a gas powered insert whatever here adventure machine, and have a commuter like an Egolf?

I'm not hating - I'm just not sold.

 

[cyure]

I understand that home charging provides immense cost reductions and that napkins math will always show that an EV is more cost friendly.... but we're forgetting the upfront cost to buy.

For the price of a loaded Hummer or Rivian - I was able to buy a loaded dealer demo Powerwagon and a used Challenger 392 with money to spare. With the money to spare, I bought a used Egolf.

All daily activities, errands, work, etc are done in the commuter. I never use public charging. The PW is for big mountain adventures. The Chally is for hooning.

Now, we've all agreed a Scout will not be efficient, BEV, EREV or ICE. A heavy, tall, square box with big rubber. It's going to be Rivian expensive we know this by initial estimates. So, you could buy a gas powered insert whatever here adventure machine, and have a commuter like an Egolf?

I'm not hating - I'm just not sold.

Hi! Everyone has to do what works for them. For me personally, it’s the Scout. I’m sold! But I’m also learning a lot on this forum. Seems like I learn something new everyday.

I started with an EREV reservation and with all the education I got in this forum I have switched to a BEV based on my driving habits.

As for price, they have said over and over and over that they are planning on $20,000 less than their competitors. It was said at reveal. I was at Nats last summer and attended their presentation and price was brought up. A SM team member reiterated $20,000 less than their competitors. Now can you get one to cost as much as a Rivian? I’m sure you can if you throw enough stuff on, but Scout has been very consistent in their messaging on price.

If you have seen me post on other threads I always say faith and patience. That’s where I am. They haven’t let me down yet and at this point all I can do is be patient and wait for actual facts.

Faith and patience.

 

[RodorW]

This is roughly what I paid after driving from about 80 to 10% every day in December charging at the end of every day that’s roughly 160 miles a day in my charger I could get about 400 and some odd miles if I’m being generous each time to fill from empty cost about $60 and would have to refill at least twice a week probably three times with the mileage I do one week is already over blowing what my current smaller EV can do. I don’t think it matters how you slice it as long as you have Home charging the EV will sweep the floor in terms of fuel cost, though there are people who will go into EVs with no plans for Home charging and then get upset that they are paying extra money, but that falls on dealers failing to educate customers and just telling them it will save them money.

 

[J Alynn]

This is roughly what I paid after driving from about 80 to 10% every day in December charging at the end of every day that’s roughly 160 miles a day in my charger I could get about 400 and some odd miles if I’m being generous each time to fill from empty cost about $60 and would have to refill at least twice a week probably three times with the mileage I do one week is already over blowing what my current smaller EV can do. I don’t think it matters how you slice it as long as you have Home charging the EV will sweep the floor in terms of fuel cost, though there are people who will go into EVs with no plans for Home charging and then get upset that they are paying extra money, but that falls on dealers failing to educate customers and just telling them it will save them money.
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There will always be a debate from either side vs costs or vs impact to environment. Each side will never agree with the other. However, nearly every major manufacturer has announced the are going to hu rods or EREVs as the stepping stone to full electric. ICE power plants are a dying technology and cost more in fuel , maintenance and complexity. If you lover your Ram stick with your Ram. As of now there is no word from SM that they are going to go back to the beginning and restart as a gas engine vehicle so if it’s in the joy of debate argue away for ICE but if you are genuinely hoping for SM to change it you are going to be disappointed. The forum has members who are scientists and BEV owners and so long as you aren’t anti-science they will prove every angle as to why BEV is a better vehicle

 

[RodorW]

I’ve never been overly concerned with the environmental stuff I do care and I know enough to tell people when they ask because a lot of people do but nothing can beat the convenience of pulling into the garage plugging in in the car, being ready to go in the morning and no longer having to go out of my way to get fuel

 

[RodorW]

I found me “December diagnostic” I’m not sure how OnStar calculates this but if the numbers are to believed that amount of fuel, 169 Gallons, would cost $509. For the month of December 2025, however the anticipated total mileage in the gas car would total closer to 4.3k

 

[LastDayScout]

This is roughly what I paid after driving from about 80 to 10% every day in December charging at the end of every day that’s roughly 160 miles a day in my charger I could get about 400 and some odd miles if I’m being generous each time to fill from empty cost about $60 and would have to refill at least twice a week probably three times with the mileage I do one week is already over blowing what my current smaller EV can do. I don’t think it matters how you slice it as long as you have Home charging the EV will sweep the floor in terms of fuel cost, though there are people who will go into EVs with no plans for Home charging and then get upset that they are paying extra money, but that falls on dealers failing to educate customers and just telling them it will save them money.
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You showed yours so I’ll show mine. This is for a bmw iX. More aerodynamic than the scout, but getting comparable for weight. This was January.

 

[RodorW]

You showed yours so I’ll show mine. This is for a bmw iX. More aerodynamic than the scout, but getting comparable for weight. This was January.
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Thanks for sharing!

Home charging is an absolute game changer, when I got my car I was on L1 90% of the time, for going to work at Amazon I would be charged by the morning most of the time, but my car wasn’t always ready to just go anywhere, still plenty for around town, but I would use DCFC once a month or so, and that adds up fast, once I started driving my own car in October last year for work I was visiting a charger every day, so as soon as we could get an
Electrician out we did, $1,300 that has already paid for itself, and while $70-100 a month in electricity sounds expensive, the 200 consumes $40 at least once a week so a minimum of $160 a month, but none of our cars see the mileage mine does

 

[LastDayScout]

Thanks for sharing!

Home charging is an absolute game changer, when I got my car I was on L1 90% of the time, for going to work at Amazon I would be charged by the morning most of the time, but my car wasn’t always ready to just go anywhere, still plenty for around town, but I would use DCFC once a month or so, and that adds up fast, once I started driving my own car in October last year for work I was visiting a charger every day, so as soon as we could get an
Electrician out we did, $1,300 that has already paid for itself, and while $70-100 a month in electricity sounds expensive, the 200 consumes $40 at least once a week so a minimum of $160 a month, but none of our cars see the mileage mine does

I got my current iX in August. I think I have used DCFC no more than twice. Of course, that will vary wildly depending on the person’s location, lifestyle and charging infrastructure.

 

[RodorW]

I got my current iX in August. I think I have used DCFC no more than twice. Of course, that will vary wildly depending on the person’s location, lifestyle and charging infrastructure.

This is less than half of my required public charging at Tesla from September, most of which was 40/50% to 80%

 

[J Alynn]

You showed yours so I’ll show mine. This is for a bmw iX. More aerodynamic than the scout, but getting comparable for weight. This was January.
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Any idea what the gas equivalent and/or your mileage was. Still trying to determine how much “fuel” savings I will see with an EV. Thanks

 

[RodorW]

Any idea what the gas equivalent and/or your mileage was. Still trying to determine how much “fuel” savings I will see with an EV. Thanks

Not apples to apples, but a further comparison on the Rivian compared to the charger, using the Rivian‘s data over 9000 miles it used around 6000 kW so if you assume that 100% of those were home charged (at least at my local rate) you get close to $550 - $600 for those 6000 kWs, but to get 9000 miles worth of gas in the charger is going to be closer to $950 - $1,000 and that is a V8 that was averaging around 25 MPG with an 18 gallon tank compared to a 135 kWh battery with a Rivian that averaged 1.4 to 1.5 kW per mile

 

[cyure]

Not apples to apples, but a further comparison on the Rivian compared to the charger, using the Rivian‘s data over 9000 miles it used around 6000 kW so if you assume that 100% of those were home charged (at least at my local rate) you get close to $550 - $600 for those 6000 kWs, but to get 9000 miles worth of gas in the charger is going to be closer to $950 - $1,000 and that is a V8 that was averaging around 25 MPG with an 18 gallon tank compared to a 135 kWh battery with a Rivian that averaged 1.4 to 1.5 kW per mile

I’m only getting about 13 mpg in my Wrangler right now. Seeing all
These comparisons with vehicles that get such better gas mileage I can’t believe it’s not going to be so much cheaper for me to go BEV.

 

[tanktheram]

The home charging argument is a nice win for any conversation at face value. My Egolf is appx $28/mo to charge from home.. weee flowers and rainbows!!! Like the iX and Bolt, it's a vehicle designed for efficiency. Ask a Hummer owner their charge costs.

I see so many of you with cars and vehicles aimed at efficiency enamoured with the fact the Scout will be car or SUV efficient, comparing it to even an Ioniq9... You're going to be sadly mistaken.

I can't say it enough times, anything with a big aggressive tire will indeed be horribly inefficient. Rivian states going from the highway oriented, efficiency rated, aerodynamic 21's, to All Terrains results in a 20% range loss. 30% in less than ideal (cold, wet, snow) conditions.

If the Scout is really launching with 35"+ all Terrains - be prepared! Not only will that Wrangler cost less to buy, it may not be far off in efficiency, without the complexities of BEV or EREV.

If you're planning for efficiencies, target somewhere between Rivian Adventure Pack and Hummer EV. This will give you a good idea.

But, what do I know. I'm just an International Motors employee for over just over 20 years. I analyze things like this daily.

Like you all hoping for something with this vehicle, I'm hoping it's not a massive failure. Wishing for ICE power and a dealership experience may help to avoid that.

Take care all,

 

[RodorW]

It's a little bit more than face value.I provided real world numbers from real world vehicles.One of which, being the less than extremely efficient rivian r1s with a large pack and quad motor. And that might be a truck, verse, a sedan, but a full size pickup truck is going to be very thirsty and more expensive.

 

[Jkew]

It would be nice to know the scout range numbers in both EPA and WLTP driving workloads. It would help me understand what I would see for my particular balance of city/fw driving.

That said, the range numbers with 35s are all that matter to me, personally, because I have cheap power where I live… far lower than the gasoline equivalent. I rarely think about the cost of charging my EV, and from what I have seen these batteries are reasonably sized at around 130kw.

The hummer has a 212kw battery… which is crazy. They just have an extraordinarily heavy vehicle and a heavy huge battery to go with it, but a hummer has always been about solving problems by adding more rather than taking away.

Ultimately I’m hoping Scout has a more balanced approach and there’s a sweet spot where “adventure vehicle” and “not a 9000lb vehicle” meet.

 

[RodorW]

I also have to admit I don’t understand how someone could feel a dealership experience would help scout but from personal experience I can’t even stand to deal with my dealership when it comes to getting my cars service done, which is just a tire rotation every other month because of the miles that I accumulate they are slow. They’re always trying to sell me something and they’re uneducated in the majority of the cars that they sell. I think an experience center is what scout should offer places with educated staff who can help people understand the vehicles, vehicles and materials on site so people can see them sit in them and drive them, but I don’t think a dealership would benefit scout at all.