Shopping for a “new” BEV while waiting for the Scout Traveler BEV.

[Scout_Lookout]

I hope Scout goes with a traditional Monroney Sticker and hosts a VIN-based lookup of the factory build sheet instead of hiding the digital sticker in the vehicle’s system. It would be fine to have that too. But there should be a more reliable way to pull the build sheet when shopping for used vehicles.

My partner was looking at used R1S options online and, as far as I can figure out, it’s basically impossible to figure out what options were built into the vehicle at the factory unless the random owner knows to and decides to take a photo of a particular screen buried in the menu of the vehicle. The sellers’ descriptions are too generic to be useful. The specs claimed on the various used vehicle databases are almost never accurate. The various VIN decoders out there are only partially useful.

All of that could be mitigated if Rivian just hosted a primary source database that can be searched by VIN to find the spec sheet.

Rivian's come with Monroney's they usually put them in the frunk at delivery. I still have mine in the plastic folder it came in.

 

[R1TVT]

Rivian's come with Monroney's they usually put them in the frunk at delivery. I still have mine in the plastic folder it came in.

Same. Mine is still sitting in the hidden compartment at the bottom of my frunk. I got a good deal at Launch!

I have all of my build info online at Rivian.com also, along with Docusigned paperwork records.

 

[J Alynn]

Same. Mine is still sitting in the hidden compartment at the bottom of my frunk. I got a good deal at Launch!

I have all of my build info online at Rivian.com also, along with Docusigned paperwork records.

Good to hear and hope SM follow suit

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

I haven’t seen a single Window Sticker / Monroney sticker with any of the used Rivians we’ve looked at. Just some sellers include a photo of the digital approximation from somewhere in the menu on the main screen.

And I can’t find anything on Rivian’s site to look up a vehicle’s details based on VIN.

None of the CarFax results I’ve seen have the original window sticker option for Rivians either.

So, how does a used car buyer independently find the sticker / build sheet?

 

[R1TVT]

I haven’t seen a single Window Sticker / Monroney sticker with any of the used Rivians we’ve looked at. Just some sellers include a photo of the digital approximation from somewhere in the menu on the main screen.

And I can’t find anything on Rivian’s site to look up a vehicle’s details based on VIN.

None of the CarFax results I’ve seen have the original window sticker option for Rivians either.

So, how does a used car buyer independently find the sticker / build sheet?

Ask the seller.

As mentioned above, all of my information is at Rivian.com and PW protected. All of my paperwork is provided via Docusign (so also PW protected). The physical print-out is located in a clear plastic sleeve exactly where it was delivered to me on delivery day - under the false floor in the lower frunk compartment (because I never bother to take it out).

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

Ask the seller.

As mentioned above, all of my information is at Rivian.com and PW protected. All of my paperwork is provided via Docusign (so also PW protected). The physical print-out is located in a clear plastic sleeve exactly where it was delivered to me on delivery day - under the false floor in the lower frunk compartment (because I never bother to take it out).

Yeah, no. It’s not worth asking about every vehicle. We’re trying to independently verify specifications on a bunch of vehicles so we can compare them. Asking the sellers of all of those vehicles would be a waste of time and energy.

It should just be available via a simple database search.

 

[Chuckles]

Hope you get to drive the Trailseeker while you're at Subaru.

Here's Car and Driver's Trailseeker review. 190 miles of range at 75 mph vs 274 EPA.

Tested: 2026 Trailseeker Is Subaru's Most On-Brand EV

A wagon-like profile, adventure-ready details, and a no-nonsense demeanor show Subaru is clued in to what its EV customers really want.

www.caranddriver.com

 

[apex96]

Here's Car and Driver's Trailseeker review. 190 miles of range at 75 mph vs 274 EPA.

Tested: 2026 Trailseeker Is Subaru's Most On-Brand EV

A wagon-like profile, adventure-ready details, and a no-nonsense demeanor show Subaru is clued in to what its EV customers really want.

www.caranddriver.com

at 75pmh that's not terrible. EPA has a few different tests that are run and the fueleconomy.gov page has some good insights.

Detailed Test Information

EPA tests vehicles by running them through a series of driving routines, or schedules, that specify vehicle speed for each point in time during the laboratory tests.

www.fueleconomy.gov

 

[Artoo]

And then add the possibility that you might have lower overnight electrical fees so you can set timing to recharge at the low cost period of the night rather than peak demand. That is a simple setting and a cash back bonus to put aside for new Scouts

This has me curious as to how other carmakers handle these settings. Apologies for the long setup here…

Like SpaceEVDriver we have a Mach-E and love it. I don’t share their couple issues with it as detailed in the initial post, and while I wait for Scout I’ve (slightly) toyed with replacing our 13 year old Civic that we hardly drive anymore with another Mach-E. However, one aspect about Ford’s software re: setting charge times drives me nuts, and in my use case it’s completely nonfunctional.

It’s based on a one-way midnight to 11:00pm 23-hour clock, and you tell it what time(s) during that clock you want it to charge. We have a Level 2 wall charger from Ford, part of the deal with the car, that can charge at 12kw however our electric panel doesn’t have an available breaker that can handle that so until we upgrade it tops out at 8 or 9kw which is still plenty fast enough. We need to upgrade the panel but it’s already 200amps, and I’m afraid what we need is a crazy-$$$ 400amp panel. The car also came with a portable Level 1 charger that can plug into a 120v socket for 1.2kw speed or a 240v socket for up to I think 6 or 7kw speed. We had to disconnect our unused 240v dryer socket on the breaker panel to make room for the level 2 charger, so the Level 1 charger runs at a slow 1.2kw. HOWEVER….

We have solar. Which is amazing and I have zero regrets. But I can’t run the house AC or the Level 2 charger during the afternoon when our solar is generating at full capacity as that dang breaker panel can’t handle the load. Invariably the solar breaker is the one that trips, rendering our solar nonfunctional until I reduce the load by disconnecting high-draw stuff. So I thought, ok, the L2 charger pulls way more power than our house battery can put out at a time anyway, pulling mostly grid power even during the day when the house battery is charged (and drains it real quick). And, my wife drove the Mustang to work every day so charging before 5pm wasn’t an option most of the time. So thought, ok, I’ll just set it to charge when grid power is cheaper starting at 9pm and ending the following 9am.

To do that, I have to set one charge time from 9pm to 11pm, then a second time from 12:00am to 9:00am. I can only set it on the hour, so I lose the 11pm to midnight hour due to bad software design. On top of that, apparently if the car thinks it won’t hit the target charge (80% usually) within the designated window…it won’t charge at all. So half the time it would do no charging at all during the 9-11pm window, and sometimes wouldn’t do it during the longer window either. Thus I had to manually start/stop charging which is a very minor annoyance until I forget to do it and it turns into a major annoyance.

Do other carmakers have better charge time-setting software? Am I doing something wrong with mine? It’s a bit of a moot point now though:

Epilogue -

Happily, a year ago March, my wife changed jobs and started working from home. When she does have to go out during the day, she has a company car (I have the same job/car…we have four cars now lol…). My little portable 1.2kw charger, while very slow, doesn’t pull enough power to cause issues with our breaker panel, and since the Mustang is home during the day now, I just charge it when the solar is generating and I pull no grid power at all.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

This has me curious as to how other carmakers handle these settings. Apologies for the long setup here…

Like SpaceEVDriver we have a Mach-E and love it. I don’t share their couple issues with it as detailed in the initial post, and while I wait for Scout I’ve (slightly) toyed with replacing our 13 year old Civic that we hardly drive anymore with another Mach-E. However, one aspect about Ford’s software re: setting charge times drives me nuts, and in my use case it’s completely nonfunctional.

It’s based on a one-way midnight to 11:00pm 23-hour clock, and you tell it what time(s) during that clock you want it to charge. We have a Level 2 wall charger from Ford, part of the deal with the car, that can charge at 12kw however our electric panel doesn’t have an available breaker that can handle that so until we upgrade it tops out at 8 or 9kw which is still plenty fast enough. We need to upgrade the panel but it’s already 200amps, and I’m afraid what we need is a crazy-$$$ 400amp panel. The car also came with a portable Level 1 charger that can plug into a 120v socket for 1.2kw speed or a 240v socket for up to I think 6 or 7kw speed. We had to disconnect our unused 240v dryer socket on the breaker panel to make room for the level 2 charger, so the Level 1 charger runs at a slow 1.2kw. HOWEVER….

We have solar. Which is amazing and I have zero regrets. But I can’t run the house AC or the Level 2 charger during the afternoon when our solar is generating at full capacity as that dang breaker panel can’t handle the load. Invariably the solar breaker is the one that trips, rendering our solar nonfunctional until I reduce the load by disconnecting high-draw stuff. So I thought, ok, the L2 charger pulls way more power than our house battery can put out at a time anyway, pulling mostly grid power even during the day when the house battery is charged (and drains it real quick). And, my wife drove the Mustang to work every day so charging before 5pm wasn’t an option most of the time. So thought, ok, I’ll just set it to charge when grid power is cheaper starting at 9pm and ending the following 9am.

To do that, I have to set one charge time from 9pm to 11pm, then a second time from 12:00am to 9:00am. I can only set it on the hour, so I lose the 11pm to midnight hour due to bad software design. On top of that, apparently if the car thinks it won’t hit the target charge (80% usually) within the designated window…it won’t charge at all. So half the time it would do no charging at all during the 9-11pm window, and sometimes wouldn’t do it during the longer window either. Thus I had to manually start/stop charging which is a very minor annoyance until I forget to do it and it turns into a major annoyance.

Do other carmakers have better charge time-setting software? Am I doing something wrong with mine? It’s a bit of a moot point now though:

Epilogue -

Happily, a year ago March, my wife changed jobs and started working from home. When she does have to go out during the day, she has a company car (I have the same job/car…we have four cars now lol…). My little portable 1.2kw charger, while very slow, doesn’t pull enough power to cause issues with our breaker panel, and since the Mustang is home during the day now, I just charge it when the solar is generating and I pull no grid power at all.

I haven’t tested it recently, but the Ford app now allows setting charge times slightly differently than it used to and it *seems* like it can span the 24:00 time slot. But, like I say, I haven’t had an occasion to test it.

If you get an Emporia EVSE with the solar monitoring upgrade, you can set the EVSE to only charge when there is excess solar. It can be plug-in or hard-wired.

 

[R1TVT]

This has me curious as to how other carmakers handle these settings. Apologies for the long setup here…

Do other carmakers have better charge time-setting software? Am I doing something wrong with mine? It’s a bit of a moot point now though:

Here some screens from the Rivian App experience for reference:

 

[Artoo]

I haven’t tested it recently, but the Ford app now allows setting charge times slightly differently than it used to and it *seems* like it can span the 24:00 time slot. But, like I say, I haven’t had an occasion to test it.

If you get an Emporia EVSE with the solar monitoring upgrade, you can set the EVSE to only charge when there is excess solar. It can be plug-in or hard-wired.

Oh that’s good to know. Admittedly I gave up on it awhile ago and haven’t looked at it recently. Also, @SpaceEVDriver if your job ever has a take-a-forum-buddy-to-work-day-so-they-can-drive-a-mars-rover (or something) let me know lol…

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

Oh that’s good to know. Admittedly I gave up on it awhile ago and haven’t looked at it recently. Also, @SpaceEVDriver if your job ever has a take-a-forum-buddy-to-work-day-so-they-can-drive-a-mars-rover (or something) let me know lol…

Every NASA center used to have at least one large public event every year. I think a lot of those (all???) were canceled after 20 January 2025.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

Oh that’s good to know. Admittedly I gave up on it awhile ago and haven’t looked at it recently. Also, @SpaceEVDriver if your job ever has a take-a-forum-buddy-to-work-day-so-they-can-drive-a-mars-rover (or something) let me know lol…

I have a public talk, “Cars on Mars,” that I’ve given to many different groups. One of the things I do is compare the distance the rovers have (had) traveled with the original requirement. I’ve often been asked, “why doesn’t JPL make cars for Earth?”

Well, because the Martian rovers aren’t exactly cheap… but these days, with new vehicle prices going through the roof, maybe they should get into that business…

 

[J Alynn]

This has me curious as to how other carmakers handle these settings. Apologies for the long setup here…

Like SpaceEVDriver we have a Mach-E and love it. I don’t share their couple issues with it as detailed in the initial post, and while I wait for Scout I’ve (slightly) toyed with replacing our 13 year old Civic that we hardly drive anymore with another Mach-E. However, one aspect about Ford’s software re: setting charge times drives me nuts, and in my use case it’s completely nonfunctional.

It’s based on a one-way midnight to 11:00pm 23-hour clock, and you tell it what time(s) during that clock you want it to charge. We have a Level 2 wall charger from Ford, part of the deal with the car, that can charge at 12kw however our electric panel doesn’t have an available breaker that can handle that so until we upgrade it tops out at 8 or 9kw which is still plenty fast enough. We need to upgrade the panel but it’s already 200amps, and I’m afraid what we need is a crazy-$$$ 400amp panel. The car also came with a portable Level 1 charger that can plug into a 120v socket for 1.2kw speed or a 240v socket for up to I think 6 or 7kw speed. We had to disconnect our unused 240v dryer socket on the breaker panel to make room for the level 2 charger, so the Level 1 charger runs at a slow 1.2kw. HOWEVER….

We have solar. Which is amazing and I have zero regrets. But I can’t run the house AC or the Level 2 charger during the afternoon when our solar is generating at full capacity as that dang breaker panel can’t handle the load. Invariably the solar breaker is the one that trips, rendering our solar nonfunctional until I reduce the load by disconnecting high-draw stuff. So I thought, ok, the L2 charger pulls way more power than our house battery can put out at a time anyway, pulling mostly grid power even during the day when the house battery is charged (and drains it real quick). And, my wife drove the Mustang to work every day so charging before 5pm wasn’t an option most of the time. So thought, ok, I’ll just set it to charge when grid power is cheaper starting at 9pm and ending the following 9am.

To do that, I have to set one charge time from 9pm to 11pm, then a second time from 12:00am to 9:00am. I can only set it on the hour, so I lose the 11pm to midnight hour due to bad software design. On top of that, apparently if the car thinks it won’t hit the target charge (80% usually) within the designated window…it won’t charge at all. So half the time it would do no charging at all during the 9-11pm window, and sometimes wouldn’t do it during the longer window either. Thus I had to manually start/stop charging which is a very minor annoyance until I forget to do it and it turns into a major annoyance.

Do other carmakers have better charge time-setting software? Am I doing something wrong with mine? It’s a bit of a moot point now though:

Epilogue -

Happily, a year ago March, my wife changed jobs and started working from home. When she does have to go out during the day, she has a company car (I have the same job/car…we have four cars now lol…). My little portable 1.2kw charger, while very slow, doesn’t pull enough power to cause issues with our breaker panel, and since the Mustang is home during the day now, I just charge it when the solar is generating and I pull no grid power at all.

I’d keep the civic personally. Such great cars and presuming you still get good mileage from it

 

[Artoo]

I’d keep the civic personally. Such great cars and presuming you still get good mileage from it

Yeah that’s kind of where I’ve landed. I was looking at a used jeep for awhile (don’t need a daily driver and I don’t really want to wait 2+ years for an off-road capable car), but what I don’t want more than the civic is another car payment. 140,000 miles on it, still gets about 40mpg (I gas it up about every 5-6 months), and going strong. Still, I’ll be curious to see where SpaceEVDriver lands on their car choice. Our situations have at least a little in common.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

My partner was looking at vehicles the other day and thought to herself that what we could do is trade the Lightning for something… But we use the crap out of the Lightning as a work truck, camping truck, and overall utility truck, so a few things would be necessary to make it worth trading:

• Would need to be a truck. Not necessarily a full-sized truck.
• Would need to be capable of towing at least 7500 pounds.
• Would need to be a higher value proposition.
• Would need to be at least as capable as the Lightning.

I just test drove a Silverado EV. There are very, very few Silverado EVs up for sale within 500-1000 miles of me, so it’s not exactly an easy vehicle to get ahold of.

The Silverado is both better and worse than the Lightning.

It's ponderous, which isn't surprising given its 2k pounds higher curb weight.

The software is more refined and faster. It doesn't have Android Auto, so to use the maps, it would require a subscription. Gross.

It's skinnier and has better steering at low speeds (with the rear steering).

It doesn't behave well under high acceleration--feels like the front tires are close to losing contact with the road. As I consider it, I think that's partly due to the rear steering. I would likely leave that off except when I needed a better steering radius...[a few minutes later]... I took it out for a second test drive with the rear steering off and it's definitely a big part of the issue.

There are some dumb oversights: There isn't a Start/Stop button; the charge port is in the rear. I don't like the automatically adjusting mirrors for backing up. I like the ability to control that myself. There's probably a setting. There's no camera view with the turn signals on.

I tested the RST so the suspension is air suspension and is adjustable. It's not as refined as the R1S or the Gravity. It definitely drives like a big, heavy truck, and the air suspension doesn't help there. It's bouncy like a boat in heat-stressed asphalt roads. But it behaves better on higher-frequency bumps.

The dealer wouldn't budge on price, though. Sigh.

 

[cyure]

My partner was looking at vehicles the other day and thought to herself that what we could do is trade the Lightning for something… But we use the crap out of the Lightning as a work truck, camping truck, and overall utility truck, so a few things would be necessary to make it worth trading:

• Would need to be a truck. Not necessarily a full-sized truck.
• Would need to be capable of towing at least 7500 pounds.
• Would need to be a higher value proposition.
• Would need to be at least as capable as the Lightning.

I just test drove a Silverado EV. There are very, very few Silverado EVs up for sale within 500-1000 miles of me, so it’s not exactly an easy vehicle to get ahold of.

The Silverado is both better and worse than the Lightning.

It's ponderous, which isn't surprising given its 2k pounds higher curb weight.

The software is more refined and faster. It doesn't have Android Auto, so to use the maps, it would require a subscription. Gross.

It's skinnier and has better steering at low speeds (with the rear steering).

It doesn't behave well under high acceleration--feels like the front tires are close to losing contact with the road. As I consider it, I think that's partly due to the rear steering. I would likely leave that off except when I needed a better steering radius...[a few minutes later]... I took it out for a second test drive with the rear steering off and it's definitely a big part of the issue.

There are some dumb oversights: There isn't a Start/Stop button; the charge port is in the rear. I don't like the automatically adjusting mirrors for backing up. I like the ability to control that myself. There's probably a setting. There's no camera view with the turn signals on.

I tested the RST so the suspension is air suspension and is adjustable. It's not as refined as the R1S or the Gravity. It definitely drives like a big, heavy truck, and the air suspension doesn't help there. It's bouncy like a boat in heat-stressed asphalt roads. But it behaves better on higher-frequency bumps.

The dealer wouldn't budge on price, though. Sigh.

You know I’m all for how the vehicle looks. Do you like how the Chevy looks better than the Ford?

 

[Chuckles]

My partner was looking at vehicles the other day and thought to herself that what we could do is trade the Lightning for something… But we use the crap out of the Lightning as a work truck, camping truck, and overall utility truck, so a few things would be necessary to make it worth trading:

• Would need to be a truck. Not necessarily a full-sized truck.
• Would need to be capable of towing at least 7500 pounds.
• Would need to be a higher value proposition.
• Would need to be at least as capable as the Lightning.

I just test drove a Silverado EV. There are very, very few Silverado EVs up for sale within 500-1000 miles of me, so it’s not exactly an easy vehicle to get ahold of.

The Silverado is both better and worse than the Lightning.

It's ponderous, which isn't surprising given its 2k pounds higher curb weight.

The software is more refined and faster. It doesn't have Android Auto, so to use the maps, it would require a subscription. Gross.

It's skinnier and has better steering at low speeds (with the rear steering).

It doesn't behave well under high acceleration--feels like the front tires are close to losing contact with the road. As I consider it, I think that's partly due to the rear steering. I would likely leave that off except when I needed a better steering radius...[a few minutes later]... I took it out for a second test drive with the rear steering off and it's definitely a big part of the issue.

There are some dumb oversights: There isn't a Start/Stop button; the charge port is in the rear. I don't like the automatically adjusting mirrors for backing up. I like the ability to control that myself. There's probably a setting. There's no camera view with the turn signals on.

I tested the RST so the suspension is air suspension and is adjustable. It's not as refined as the R1S or the Gravity. It definitely drives like a big, heavy truck, and the air suspension doesn't help there. It's bouncy like a boat in heat-stressed asphalt roads. But it behaves better on higher-frequency bumps.

The dealer wouldn't budge on price, though. Sigh.

FYI--GM includes 8 years of Onstar Basics (including maps).

https://www.onstar.com/standard-content

 

[Mousehunter]

Got a golf cart while I was waiting. Golf carts are about the only current BEV's I am interested in. Upgraded the batteries, motor, and controller already. Upgraded suspension is still sitting in a crate because I needed new leaf bushings first - finally ordered those, and replacement leafs.