Range anxiety

[Dgarcia]

Can Scout make an additional range display that shows range in a traditional fuel gauge format? When I used a gas vehicle I couldn’t tell you how many miles a tank would get me. I just knew it was enough. Ev’s are about as reliable as gas vehicles now so I feel like I don’t have to monitor the battery so closely. I think a gauge that shows battery levels in broad increments (0, 30, 55, 80 and 100 percent markers?) could help with any over monitoring. I want the option to tune out specific mileage, specific battery percentage and any range maps without having to block out battery levels completely. Watching the battery drain this closely can cause frequent overthinking about conserving energy instead of just using my vehicle comfortably. Right now my best option is to change my dash display to something else and check battery percentage every few days. It’s not a big deal but I would like the same feeling as when I drove a gas vehicle. I’m curious how else Scout approaches range anxiety from a psychological perspective. I think this display would also fit in nicely with the classic car design elements.

It also looks like Scout will have a 240v outlet and hopefully this works for vehicle to vehicle charging with an L2 charging cable in case you do run out of battery. This would also be useful if you took a two car camping trip and could charge the towing vehicle with the non-towing vehicle. I’d be more interested in making remote tows work with V2V charging than the gas harvester personally. I know you probably can’t get near the 500 mile range this way but I would probably never need that much either.

 

[maynard]

Can Scout make an additional range display that shows range in a traditional fuel gauge format? When I used a gas vehicle I couldn’t tell you how many miles a tank would get me. I just knew it was enough. Ev’s are about as reliable as gas vehicles now so I feel like I don’t have to monitor the battery so closely. I think a gauge that shows battery levels in broad increments (0, 30, 55, 80 and 100 percent markers?) could help with any over monitoring. I want the option to tune out specific mileage, specific battery percentage and any range maps without having to block out battery levels completely. Watching the battery drain this closely can cause frequent overthinking about conserving energy instead of just using my vehicle comfortably. Right now my best option is to change my dash display to something else and check battery percentage every few days. It’s not a big deal but I would like the same feeling as when I drove a gas vehicle. I’m curious how else Scout approaches range anxiety from a psychological perspective. I think this display would also fit in nicely with the classic car design elements.

It also looks like Scout will have a 240v outlet and hopefully this works for vehicle to vehicle charging with an L2 charging cable in case you do run out of battery. This would also be useful if you took a two car camping trip and could charge the towing vehicle with the non-towing vehicle. I’d be more interested in making remote tows work with V2V charging than the gas harvester personally. I know you probably can’t get near the 500 mile range this way but I would probably never need that much either.

Welcome to the community!
Thanks for your post.

 

[J Alynn]

Can Scout make an additional range display that shows range in a traditional fuel gauge format? When I used a gas vehicle I couldn’t tell you how many miles a tank would get me. I just knew it was enough. Ev’s are about as reliable as gas vehicles now so I feel like I don’t have to monitor the battery so closely. I think a gauge that shows battery levels in broad increments (0, 30, 55, 80 and 100 percent markers?) could help with any over monitoring. I want the option to tune out specific mileage, specific battery percentage and any range maps without having to block out battery levels completely. Watching the battery drain this closely can cause frequent overthinking about conserving energy instead of just using my vehicle comfortably. Right now my best option is to change my dash display to something else and check battery percentage every few days. It’s not a big deal but I would like the same feeling as when I drove a gas vehicle. I’m curious how else Scout approaches range anxiety from a psychological perspective. I think this display would also fit in nicely with the classic car design elements.

It also looks like Scout will have a 240v outlet and hopefully this works for vehicle to vehicle charging with an L2 charging cable in case you do run out of battery. This would also be useful if you took a two car camping trip and could charge the towing vehicle with the non-towing vehicle. I’d be more interested in making remote tows work with V2V charging than the gas harvester personally. I know you probably can’t get near the 500 mile range this way but I would probably never need that much either.

Thanks for posting. It’s worth the ask. They’ve shown a speedo in an original style format so why not a “fuel” gauge of sorts

 

[cyure]

Can Scout make an additional range display that shows range in a traditional fuel gauge format? When I used a gas vehicle I couldn’t tell you how many miles a tank would get me. I just knew it was enough. Ev’s are about as reliable as gas vehicles now so I feel like I don’t have to monitor the battery so closely. I think a gauge that shows battery levels in broad increments (0, 30, 55, 80 and 100 percent markers?) could help with any over monitoring. I want the option to tune out specific mileage, specific battery percentage and any range maps without having to block out battery levels completely. Watching the battery drain this closely can cause frequent overthinking about conserving energy instead of just using my vehicle comfortably. Right now my best option is to change my dash display to something else and check battery percentage every few days. It’s not a big deal but I would like the same feeling as when I drove a gas vehicle. I’m curious how else Scout approaches range anxiety from a psychological perspective. I think this display would also fit in nicely with the classic car design elements.

It also looks like Scout will have a 240v outlet and hopefully this works for vehicle to vehicle charging with an L2 charging cable in case you do run out of battery. This would also be useful if you took a two car camping trip and could charge the towing vehicle with the non-towing vehicle. I’d be more interested in making remote tows work with V2V charging than the gas harvester personally. I know you probably can’t get near the 500 mile range this way but I would probably never need that much either.

Welcome to the community.

 

[R1TVT]

Can Scout make an additional range display that shows range in a traditional fuel gauge format? When I used a gas vehicle I couldn’t tell you how many miles a tank would get me. I just knew it was enough. Ev’s are about as reliable as gas vehicles now so I feel like I don’t have to monitor the battery so closely. I think a gauge that shows battery levels in broad increments (0, 30, 55, 80 and 100 percent markers?) could help with any over monitoring. I want the option to tune out specific mileage, specific battery percentage and any range maps without having to block out battery levels completely. Watching the battery drain this closely can cause frequent overthinking about conserving energy instead of just using my vehicle comfortably. Right now my best option is to change my dash display to something else and check battery percentage every few days. It’s not a big deal but I would like the same feeling as when I drove a gas vehicle. I’m curious how else Scout approaches range anxiety from a psychological perspective. I think this display would also fit in nicely with the classic car design elements.

It also looks like Scout will have a 240v outlet and hopefully this works for vehicle to vehicle charging with an L2 charging cable in case you do run out of battery. This would also be useful if you took a two car camping trip and could charge the towing vehicle with the non-towing vehicle. I’d be more interested in making remote tows work with V2V charging than the gas harvester personally. I know you probably can’t get near the 500 mile range this way but I would probably never need that much either.

I'm not sure I follow. If a half a tank of gas gives you anxiety, showing a battery SOC icon at half will give you same anxiety, correct? If you elect to display range in miles and your truck shows you that you have 175 miles of range left (with either gas or electric), it's showing you the same thing: you have 175 miles to "empty".

 

[oldgeeksguide]

I'm not sure I follow. If a half a tank of gas gives you anxiety, showing a battery SOC icon at half will give you same anxiety, correct? If you elect to display range in miles and your truck shows you that you have 175 miles of range left (with either gas or electric), it's showing you the same thing: you have 175 miles to "empty".

I don’t presume to speak for the OP, but I’m guessing he’s referring to the fact that when you’re looking at the number, it’s changing very quickly, ie at highway speed it’s changing every minute. Watching the number change quickly can be more stressful than watching a gradual change of a less precise, but familiar, image like a gas gauge.

 

[R1TVT]

I don’t presume to speak for the OP, but I’m guessing he’s referring to the fact that when you’re looking at the number, it’s changing very quickly, ie at highway speed it’s changing every minute. Watching the number change quickly can be more stressful than watching a gradual change of a less precise, but familiar, image like a gas gauge.

Most modern EV's allow you to set preferences and displays with data you want to see, including any range or efficiency data.

I drove for 2 hours the other night and went from something like 80% to 50%, nothing about that was happening any slower or faster than it would watching a fuel gauge drop to half a tank in an ICE vehicle.

 

[speedrye]

Most modern EV's allow you to set preferences and displays with data you want to see, including any range or efficiency data.

I drove for 2 hours the other night and went from something like 80% to 50%, nothing about that was happening any slower or faster than it would watching a fuel gauge drop to half a tank in an ICE vehicle.

Most ICE vehicles have the option too. Look at the fuel gauge, or look at the miles remaining, both work. I usually just use the gas gauge unless I know I'll really be pushing it, then I'll swap to miles remaining. I'd likely do the same in an EV. Just use a dummy gauge 95% of the time, but when I know I'll be pushing it, I'll swap to a more detailed view. Driving hybrids and EVs, I've found I get distracted with too many numbers, because I love numbers. I'll have to actively avoid them, and a dummy gauge would be an easy way to avoid that temptation/distraction.

 

[R1TVT]

Agreed. And at least in my R1T, I have access to a whole lot more information about charging, range, efficiency, vehicle health, etc. (if I want it), than I did in any ICE vehicle I have ever owned. I think the better the SW, the better the experience for the driver. Maybe another good reminder that Scout will have an advantage out of the gate with Rivian and the Zonal partnership (which in theory should make it easier for Scout to allow for great flexibility when it comes to configurations and settings).

 

[LastDayScout]

Can Scout make an additional range display that shows range in a traditional fuel gauge format? When I used a gas vehicle I couldn’t tell you how many miles a tank would get me. I just knew it was enough. Ev’s are about as reliable as gas vehicles now so I feel like I don’t have to monitor the battery so closely. I think a gauge that shows battery levels in broad increments (0, 30, 55, 80 and 100 percent markers?) could help with any over monitoring. I want the option to tune out specific mileage, specific battery percentage and any range maps without having to block out battery levels completely. Watching the battery drain this closely can cause frequent overthinking about conserving energy instead of just using my vehicle comfortably. Right now my best option is to change my dash display to something else and check battery percentage every few days. It’s not a big deal but I would like the same feeling as when I drove a gas vehicle. I’m curious how else Scout approaches range anxiety from a psychological perspective. I think this display would also fit in nicely with the classic car design elements.

It also looks like Scout will have a 240v outlet and hopefully this works for vehicle to vehicle charging with an L2 charging cable in case you do run out of battery. This would also be useful if you took a two car camping trip and could charge the towing vehicle with the non-towing vehicle. I’d be more interested in making remote tows work with V2V charging than the gas harvester personally. I know you probably can’t get near the 500 mile range this way but I would probably never need that much either.

This is probable/likely. On many EVs you can configure the way you want the remaining energy to display i.e. miles vs. percentage vs. battery icon. Kind of like a smartphone does.

 

[Mousehunter]

My main issue with range anxiety is that published range and 20-80% range (which is what we care about for battery life) is something completely different. If you start with 350 miles, the 20-80% range is 200 miles. Honestly, I can barely do a round trip to the nearest city with 200 miles (closest city is 90 miles). God forbid if I want to tow something. Still, the best option is the Scout. I don't even want to think about how other options fail to compare. Sure a Tesla car might give me better range - but I have absolutely no desire to get another car.

 

[R1TVT]

My main issue with range anxiety is that published range and 20-80% range (which is what we care about for battery life) is something completely different. If you start with 350 miles, the 20-80% range is 200 miles. Honestly, I can barely do a round trip to the nearest city with 200 miles (closest city is 90 miles). God forbid if I want to tow something. Still, the best option is the Scout. I don't even want to think about how other options fail to compare. Sure a Tesla car might give me better range - but I have absolutely no desire to get another car.

This makes no sense to me. If you want full range, don't charge to 80% - charge to 100%.

Charging to 100% can actually be good for some batteries when going on road trips.

I charge to 100% almost every other week!

 

[Broverlander]

This makes no sense to me. If you want full range, don't charge to 80% - charge to 100%.

Charging to 100% can actually be good for some batteries when going on road trips.

I charge to 100% almost every other week!

I agree with this and it depends on your battery chemistry. I have NMC, which you're only supposed to charge regularly to 80%. That's what I do daily. But on long road trips, I charge to 100% and it's fine to go below 20%. The issue with 20% is you don't want to hold that state of charge parked. Same with the 100%. On LFP batteries (which I understand the Harvester will have), it's actually best to charge to 100%. I've had my Rivian for two years and still have "range anxiety." Not in the true sense though. I know I can find reliable chargers on major highways. But the "anxiety" part is how long it takes to get form 20-80% (about a half hour for me). I just want to get where I'm going. Also, off the major highways, good luck. I live in Minneapolis/St. Paul. I wanted to drive to Lambeau Field in Green Bay last year but I legit couldn't take my Rivian because there wasn't a fast charger anywhere close to Green Bay. There's where the infrastructure is still missing. Also, the winter is a real problem on batteries up here.

 

[strider]

My main issue with range anxiety is that published range and 20-80% range (which is what we care about for battery life) is something completely different. If you start with 350 miles, the 20-80% range is 200 miles. Honestly, I can barely do a round trip to the nearest city with 200 miles (closest city is 90 miles). God forbid if I want to tow something. Still, the best option is the Scout. I don't even want to think about how other options fail to compare. Sure a Tesla car might give me better range - but I have absolutely no desire to get another car.

How often are you driving more than 200 miles in a day? As @R1TVT said, if you need to "go to town" charge to 100% and just drive the vehicle. If that's not enough then get a Harvester.

Please know that the amount of driving that you are implying is not "normal." It is way outside the vast majority of what people do with their vehicles. I will lump many of Space's use cases into this as well - he also lives a very unique life. Scout needs to build a vehicle that will cover the bulk of their target market for the lowest possible cost. It is a fact that most people drive like 30-40 miles per day, not 200. The market for edge cases is not large enough to support the company.

Heck, I push the bounds some days. If my wife is unavailable I'm looking at 160 miles of shuttling kids back and forth to swim and ballet practice but I can still comfortably do that charging my MXP to 80% (230 miles nominal range at that level).

The industry has settled on 300-350 miles of range as the sweet spot for cost, weight, and range. They are now working to fill in the gaps in charging so that range is sufficient for the vast majority of people.

If you don't fit into that use case, there is always the Harvester (or Silverado EV or Lucid or the upcoming iX3 if it lives up to the range hype).

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

How often are you driving more than 200 miles in a day? As @R1TVT said, if you need to "go to town" charge to 100% and just drive the vehicle. If that's not enough then get a Harvester.

Please know that the amount of driving that you are implying is not "normal." It is way outside the vast majority of what people do with their vehicles. I will lump many of Space's use cases into this as well - he also lives a very unique life. Scout needs to build a vehicle that will cover the bulk of their target market for the lowest possible cost. It is a fact that most people drive like 30-40 miles per day, not 200. The market for edge cases is not large enough to support the company.

Heck, I push the bounds some days. If my wife is unavailable I'm looking at 160 miles of shuttling kids back and forth to swim and ballet practice but I can still comfortably do that charging my MXP to 80% (230 miles nominal range at that level).

The industry has settled on 300-350 miles of range as the sweet spot for cost, weight, and range. They are now working to fill in the gaps in charging so that range is sufficient for the vast majority of people.

If you don't fit into that use case, there is always the Harvester (or Silverado EV or Lucid or the upcoming iX3 if it lives up to the range hype).

I agree I live a unique life. And I will say I mostly agree with you regarding range and charge. Most people don’t need anywhere near the range they’ve been told they need, especially not for daily driving.

It’s too bad someone started the myth that EV batteries can’t be charged to 100%. These are lithium batteries, not lead-acid. They can safely be charged to 100% on the regular. The issue isn’t getting them to 100%. It’s leaving them at 100% for long periods of time (weeks) at high temperatures (>55 ºC). NMC and LFP can both be safely charged to 100% (and then driven) without degradation worth worrying about.

We charge the Silverado up to 100% all the time. Mostly because we use excess solar to charge it, so it usually takes a week or more to reach 100% after a long trip and by then it’s time for another long trip. Example: I got back from the Los Angeles area two weeks ago and plugged it in to charge on the solar charger. Because it’s monsoon season, the excess solar has been spotty and charging from <10% to 100% from has taken two weeks. It reached 100% two days ago. Today we go on another long trip. We won’t need the full charge; we’re only going about 300 miles. But I didn’t see a reason to stop it at a lower charge.

 

[Mousehunter]

I live about 90 miles from the nearest major city (3 are at that range - add in a few errands and it can easily tag 200 miles). Those are about 2x a month now.. Family lives about 120 miles away, so 240+ mile in a day (generally montly). My vacation rental is closer to 240 miles one way - which I occasionally have to make repair trips to (and the closest fast charger is 60 miles away from it on my normal route - so I will probably end up pushing 300+ miles before the fast charge). While I do that trip about 6 times a year, most of them are weekend trips and I can charge there. Before I retired, 200 miles was pretty much my average daily commute. Fishing and kayaking are also pretty much 200 mile trips as well - but I don't fish and kayak nearly enough anymore. I do have closer river kayaking, but it is only viable when the flow is down-upstream against a hard current is not all that fun.

If I have a heads up - sure I can charge to 100%. But it is not uncommon for the trips to have short notice. I am not the normal - well I am the rural Texas normal I guess. Part of the cost of living in the middle of nowhere is 200 mile trips are fairly common - pretty much weekly since I retired (and hope springs eternal on fishing and kayaking more, that could push it up to 2x a week - I used to kayak and fish a lot).