I Recently Rented a Gas Vehicle—Here’s my Review

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SpaceEVDriver

Scout Community Veteran
Oct 26, 2024
538
1,573
Arizona
This is a satirical, yet mostly accurate review of having to rent a gas-fueled vehicle for a week after years of mostly EV only driving…

I recently was on travel and the car rental place didn't have any normal cars, so I had to rent a gas vehicle. I figured it couldn't be that hard; lots of people do it.

When we picked it up, the first thing I noticed right away is that it doesn't have a frunk. Under the front compartment lid is just a big mess of dirty, greasy wires, tubes, aluminum, and other stuff. I would not enjoy working on something so complicated. Fortunately it's not mine. Just a rental.

And no frunk! What modern vehicle doesn't have a frunk!? I know, there are several. But, still. Where am I supposed to put my luggage? My sandy clothes? I packed stuff into the back compartment.

I got in and pressed the start button. The whole vehicle shuddered for a couple of seconds. I worried it was going to fall apart like in the old silent moving pictures. After a couple of seconds, the shuddering stopped and the vehicle started humming. Not only could you hear it, you could feel it. A gauge on the dash spun up, then settled down to a low number, but not zero. Great, it works. That full vehicle hum won't be too bad. I turned on the AC (physical control! Yay!) and the vents started blowing cold-ish air.

It took us a couple of seconds to figure out how to connect our phone and to program the navigation to take us where we were going. Fortunately the truck has Android Auto, so it wasn't too difficult.

I then spent several minutes trying to figure out where the seat back adjustment is. Turns out it's a strap! How retro! I had to get out of the truck to find that strap on the side of the seat. I got back in the truck, adjusted the mirrors, and checked that we were ready to go. Passengers ready.

I looked at the vehicle’s indicators. The little gauge indicated it was at 0 rpm, which seemed weird. I thought it was running. Press the start button again. It was not happy about that! I found out later, after being surprised by it several times, that the truck shuts off its power plant when it idles for too long. Great! That makes sense. I guess if I’d researched the vehicle a bit before we got here, I might have known.

I put it in drive, and started to pull out of the parking spot. Oh, goodness, this handles weird. The background hum becomes more of a roar. There’s a weird clunk every so often when the vehicle is accelerating and the roar becomes a hum again. Then it builds up to a roar. Weird. Not sure I’m going to like that.

As we were pulling onto the main road, I looked down at the dash and noticed that the energy indicator was at only 25%, which, fine, I guess—we’ll return it with a similar amount. The range estimator said 80 miles range, so I started looking for a refueling station. There was a sketchy one across and down the street from the rental place. I wasn’t excited about using it, but I wasn't sure where the next one would be, so I stopped there.

It took a few tries to figure out how to get the truck refueled. Apparently there are two major different kinds of fuel for gas vehicles. One with a green handle and one with a black handle. And you have to get the right one for your vehicle or you can destroy the vehicle. But they’re both offered at the same fueling station and even on the same fueling post. There was nothing obvious on the dash or at the plug that said which one I was supposed up use. One plug (the green one) didn't fit, so it was obviously not that one. The other plug fit. But it had another three options. I just went with the cheapest---hey, it's a rental. It’s very weird that you have to know and memorize what kind of energy is compatible with your vehicle, though.

Anyway, I plugged it in and nothing happened. I realized I had to choose the right type, so I did that (the cheapest). But still it didn't start fueling. I found a lever on the plug that goes into the vehicle and pulled it... And still nothing happened. The screen was asking me for my loyalty card. Skipped that. Then it asked me for my credit card. It's not just Plug and Charge! I swiped my credit card. It took a minute to approve it, but finally it told me I could dispense the fuel. There's a lever on the refueling plug that you have to hold down to charge refuel and you can't just start it and go to the restroom. Fortunately I had gone at the airport. But I still couldn’t just leave it. I had to stand there and breathe in the awful-smelling fuel instead of going to the restroom. What a pain.

Anyway, about ten minutes after stopping, we had 100% fuel. It cost $55!!! That's 10x what it costs to charge our battery from 0% to 100%.

I disconnected the refuel plug, hung it back up, and the machine printed a paper receipt. Weird. Got in the truck and pressed the start button. It roared and then hummed. I looked down at the instrument cluster and noticed that it was back up to 100% and it was claiming 320 miles of range. That’s the same range as my truck.

I put it into drive and headed onto the highway.

This thing handles like…well, not well. It weaves all over the place. Its power plant noise grows to a roar, then the vehicle shudders and a weird clunk happens and the roar dies back down to a hum and starts climbing again.

There’s no one-pedal drive. Not only that, there’s no regeneration. You have to use the friction brakes. Which squeal when they get wet.

There’s no regeneration! Can you believe that?! Not only is the fuel for this thing super expensive, you can’t even recover any when slowing down. Whenever it’s on, it’s burning the fuel (except when it shuts itself off at a stop light and you don’t know if it’s just quit or is saving fuel). Seems very wasteful.

Anyway, we drove the 10 miles to the hotel, all the while marveling at the weird design decisions: No 1-pd; no regeneration; very, very noisy; clunky-jerky behavior when the roar dies down to a hum; squealing friction brakes. Oh, and taking your foot off the accelerator doesn’t turn on your brake lights either. I found that out when the person behind me got super close. I guess that’s okay because it doesn’t use 1-pd and so the truck just kind of keeps rolling along when it should slow down significantly.

Got to the hotel and looked for the place to refuel. We didn’t need a lot, but I always try to refuel overnight. The hotel doesn’t have a Level 2 refueling option.

I looked it up later. Apparently the fuel is so toxic and dangerous that it’s heavily regulated and can only be dispensed at specific locations. Hotels are typically not certified to dispense the fuel. In fact, it’s also generally not possible to have a home refueling station. You always have to go refuel at one of these special, but sketchy stations. I don’t know how anyone can stand that. Can you imagine using an energy source that’s so dangerous that it’s regulated so heavily that you cannot generate your own at home? But this stuff really is dangerous and I understand why it has to be regulated.

I’m happy I have a roof that uses sunlight to create my vehicle’s energy.

Anyway, we drove around the next several days. Still trying to get used to the noise and bad handling of the vehicle. One night, we had to rush to the other side of the island we were on to catch a short-lived geological event. There was some major concern among my passengers that we wouldn’t be able to make it if we didn’t find a place to refuel. I briefly tried to figure out where the refueling stations are. Google has many of them in their database. And there are a lot more than I expected. But then I looked at the range estimate and if it was accurate, we wouldn’t need to refuel. So we went for it. I wasn’t interested in going to one of those stations at night, so was grateful we had enough to make it.

On the other side of the island, our hotel again didn’t have an overnight refueling station. I can’t believe how inconvenient this is! The next morning, we had to make a special trip just to find a refueling station. Unlike on PlugShare, you can’t generally see the prices on an app, so we had to drive past several before we were able to find one that was almost affordable. It cost another $50 to refuel! I still can’t believe how expensive it is. We drove about 500 miles over the course of the week. The cost was a little over $200 to drive those 500 miles. With the lightning, I can drive 500 miles for about $7.00 when charging at home and about $70-$90 when on road trips if I charge at expensive fast chargers.

Anyway, I was happy to return the vehicle and get back to my truck. I know this is likely not representative of every gas vehicle, but after driving this Jeep, I’m certain I don’t want a gas vehicle. They're smelly, loud, expensive to drive, handle like crap, use toxic fuels. And they’re noisy. Did I mention how noisy they are? There’s no regenerative braking—which just seems so wasteful, especially considering the cost of fuel. The infotainment tech was from the mid 2010s. I did not enjoy driving it at all.

I don’t really know what the benefits are. I guess if you got a much larger tank you could go a longer distance, but the cost of the fuel is so high it doesn’t make sense to me. There are a lot more refueling stations, but so many of the ones we saw were super sketchy, weren’t associated with places to eat—they were just kind of islands unto themselves. They really didn’t have much to recommend them. And the one where I used the restroom was so very gross.

Overall: Two thumbs down. Would not recommend.

Screenshot 2025-05-26 at 22.26.28.png
 
This is a satirical, yet mostly accurate review of having to rent a gas-fueled vehicle for a week after years of mostly EV only driving…

I recently was on travel and the car rental place didn't have any normal cars, so I had to rent a gas vehicle. I figured it couldn't be that hard; lots of people do it.

When we picked it up, the first thing I noticed right away is that it doesn't have a frunk. Under the front compartment lid is just a big mess of dirty, greasy wires, tubes, aluminum, and other stuff. I would not enjoy working on something so complicated. Fortunately it's not mine. Just a rental.

And no frunk! What modern vehicle doesn't have a frunk!? I know, there are several. But, still. Where am I supposed to put my luggage? My sandy clothes? I packed stuff into the back compartment.

I got in and pressed the start button. The whole vehicle shuddered for a couple of seconds. I worried it was going to fall apart like in the old silent moving pictures. After a couple of seconds, the shuddering stopped and the vehicle started humming. Not only could you hear it, you could feel it. A gauge on the dash spun up, then settled down to a low number, but not zero. Great, it works. That full vehicle hum won't be too bad. I turned on the AC (physical control! Yay!) and the vents started blowing cold-ish air.

It took us a couple of seconds to figure out how to connect our phone and to program the navigation to take us where we were going. Fortunately the truck has Android Auto, so it wasn't too difficult.

I then spent several minutes trying to figure out where the seat back adjustment is. Turns out it's a strap! How retro! I had to get out of the truck to find that strap on the side of the seat. I got back in the truck, adjusted the mirrors, and checked that we were ready to go. Passengers ready.

I looked at the vehicle’s indicators. The little gauge indicated it was at 0 rpm, which seemed weird. I thought it was running. Press the start button again. It was not happy about that! I found out later, after being surprised by it several times, that the truck shuts off its power plant when it idles for too long. Great! That makes sense. I guess if I’d researched the vehicle a bit before we got here, I might have known.

I put it in drive, and started to pull out of the parking spot. Oh, goodness, this handles weird. The background hum becomes more of a roar. There’s a weird clunk every so often when the vehicle is accelerating and the roar becomes a hum again. Then it builds up to a roar. Weird. Not sure I’m going to like that.

As we were pulling onto the main road, I looked down at the dash and noticed that the energy indicator was at only 25%, which, fine, I guess—we’ll return it with a similar amount. The range estimator said 80 miles range, so I started looking for a refueling station. There was a sketchy one across and down the street from the rental place. I wasn’t excited about using it, but I wasn't sure where the next one would be, so I stopped there.

It took a few tries to figure out how to get the truck refueled. Apparently there are two major different kinds of fuel for gas vehicles. One with a green handle and one with a black handle. And you have to get the right one for your vehicle or you can destroy the vehicle. But they’re both offered at the same fueling station and even on the same fueling post. There was nothing obvious on the dash or at the plug that said which one I was supposed up use. One plug (the green one) didn't fit, so it was obviously not that one. The other plug fit. But it had another three options. I just went with the cheapest---hey, it's a rental. It’s very weird that you have to know and memorize what kind of energy is compatible with your vehicle, though.

Anyway, I plugged it in and nothing happened. I realized I had to choose the right type, so I did that (the cheapest). But still it didn't start fueling. I found a lever on the plug that goes into the vehicle and pulled it... And still nothing happened. The screen was asking me for my loyalty card. Skipped that. Then it asked me for my credit card. It's not just Plug and Charge! I swiped my credit card. It took a minute to approve it, but finally it told me I could dispense the fuel. There's a lever on the refueling plug that you have to hold down to charge refuel and you can't just start it and go to the restroom. Fortunately I had gone at the airport. But I still couldn’t just leave it. I had to stand there and breathe in the awful-smelling fuel instead of going to the restroom. What a pain.

Anyway, about ten minutes after stopping, we had 100% fuel. It cost $55!!! That's 10x what it costs to charge our battery from 0% to 100%.

I disconnected the refuel plug, hung it back up, and the machine printed a paper receipt. Weird. Got in the truck and pressed the start button. It roared and then hummed. I looked down at the instrument cluster and noticed that it was back up to 100% and it was claiming 320 miles of range. That’s the same range as my truck.

I put it into drive and headed onto the highway.

This thing handles like…well, not well. It weaves all over the place. Its power plant noise grows to a roar, then the vehicle shudders and a weird clunk happens and the roar dies back down to a hum and starts climbing again.

There’s no one-pedal drive. Not only that, there’s no regeneration. You have to use the friction brakes. Which squeal when they get wet.

There’s no regeneration! Can you believe that?! Not only is the fuel for this thing super expensive, you can’t even recover any when slowing down. Whenever it’s on, it’s burning the fuel (except when it shuts itself off at a stop light and you don’t know if it’s just quit or is saving fuel). Seems very wasteful.

Anyway, we drove the 10 miles to the hotel, all the while marveling at the weird design decisions: No 1-pd; no regeneration; very, very noisy; clunky-jerky behavior when the roar dies down to a hum; squealing friction brakes. Oh, and taking your foot off the accelerator doesn’t turn on your brake lights either. I found that out when the person behind me got super close. I guess that’s okay because it doesn’t use 1-pd and so the truck just kind of keeps rolling along when it should slow down significantly.

Got to the hotel and looked for the place to refuel. We didn’t need a lot, but I always try to refuel overnight. The hotel doesn’t have a Level 2 refueling option.

I looked it up later. Apparently the fuel is so toxic and dangerous that it’s heavily regulated and can only be dispensed at specific locations. Hotels are typically not certified to dispense the fuel. In fact, it’s also generally not possible to have a home refueling station. You always have to go refuel at one of these special, but sketchy stations. I don’t know how anyone can stand that. Can you imagine using an energy source that’s so dangerous that it’s regulated so heavily that you cannot generate your own at home? But this stuff really is dangerous and I understand why it has to be regulated.

I’m happy I have a roof that uses sunlight to create my vehicle’s energy.

Anyway, we drove around the next several days. Still trying to get used to the noise and bad handling of the vehicle. One night, we had to rush to the other side of the island we were on to catch a short-lived geological event. There was some major concern among my passengers that we wouldn’t be able to make it if we didn’t find a place to refuel. I briefly tried to figure out where the refueling stations are. Google has many of them in their database. And there are a lot more than I expected. But then I looked at the range estimate and if it was accurate, we wouldn’t need to refuel. So we went for it. I wasn’t interested in going to one of those stations at night, so was grateful we had enough to make it.

On the other side of the island, our hotel again didn’t have an overnight refueling station. I can’t believe how inconvenient this is! The next morning, we had to make a special trip just to find a refueling station. Unlike on PlugShare, you can’t generally see the prices on an app, so we had to drive past several before we were able to find one that was almost affordable. It cost another $50 to refuel! I still can’t believe how expensive it is. We drove about 500 miles over the course of the week. The cost was a little over $200 to drive those 500 miles. With the lightning, I can drive 500 miles for about $7.00 when charging at home and about $70-$90 when on road trips if I charge at expensive fast chargers.

Anyway, I was happy to return the vehicle and get back to my truck. I know this is likely not representative of every gas vehicle, but after driving this Jeep, I’m certain I don’t want a gas vehicle. They're smelly, loud, expensive to drive, handle like crap, use toxic fuels. And they’re noisy. Did I mention how noisy they are? There’s no regenerative braking—which just seems so wasteful, especially considering the cost of fuel. The infotainment tech was from the mid 2010s. I did not enjoy driving it at all.

I don’t really know what the benefits are. I guess if you got a much larger tank you could go a longer distance, but the cost of the fuel is so high it doesn’t make sense to me. There are a lot more refueling stations, but so many of the ones we saw were super sketchy, weren’t associated with places to eat—they were just kind of islands unto themselves. They really didn’t have much to recommend them. And the one where I used the restroom was so very gross.

Overall: Two thumbs down. Would not recommend.

View attachment 6778
Okay @SpaceEVDriver that was amazing. Well when you put it this way! And what’s the first thing I do when I get in our Supra? Put it in sport mode so it won’t turn off at stoplights, which decreases the range. And I understand why tech stays around in some cars so long it’s cheaper than a redesign but honestly I test drove a 24 4Runner last year. That interior tech was literally 15 years old. 15! It felt like going in a Time Machine.

Okay can you help me with something? I’m going to Nationals and I want to plot out the trip as if it were electric and how long it would take with charging and then I’ll time us to see the difference. I downloaded APRB and put in a Rivian but honestly may not have picked what’s comparable to a Scout because they have all these different number of motors etc.

It’s a 342 mile trip. The app is telling me 2 stops, 42 minutes of charge time total. That sounds right to me, but it only has us arriving at our destination with 10% charge. That doesn’t sound correct. If you need more info just let me know. Thanks in advance!!
 
Yeah, the R1 or Lightning with extended range is right. For 342 miles, I would probably only stop once unless I needed a second bio break.

ABRP is set by default to arrive with 10%, so it's probably planning a couple of short stops that bring you to 60% or so at each stop.

I only use the desktop website, so I don't know layout of the app. There's a control to set your arrival state of charge. There's another control to change the stop frequency-many short stops or fewer, longer stops. Play with that. The start state of charge defaults to 90%. It's nonsense. Start every long journey with 100%.

ABRP is conservative in my experience. I would guess the truck only needs a single 25-30 minute stop. If you get 2.2 miles per kWh, you'd need a total of 155 kWh. Start with 100% in an R1S with Large Pack (135 kWh). Drive an average of 65 mph (73 mph on the freeway} for 3 hours to go 195 miles, using 89 kWh. You have 56 kWh, 34% left. Charge to 80%, adding 62 kWh (46%) to the battery. If you get an average of 150 kW charge rate, that's 25 minutes. Maybe you get 120 kW average for a 31 minute stop.

You have 342-195=147 miles to go. The truck has 80% charge or 108 kWh. Using 2.2 miles/kWh efficiency, you use 67 kWh, leaving you with 41 kWh or 30% battery remaining.

Unless you drive faster or somehow you get less than 2.0 miles/kWh, I don't think the truck needs a second stop. But if you need a second stop, you might as well charge.
 
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Yeah, the R1 or Lightning with extended range is right. For 342 miles, I would probably only stop once unless I needed a second bio break.

ABRP is set by default to arrive with 10%, so it's probably planning a couple of short stops that bring you to 60% or so at each stop.

I only use the desktop website, so I don't know layout of the app. There's a control to set your arrival state of charge. There's another control to change the stop frequency-many short stops or fewer, longer stops. Play with that. The start state of charge defaults to 90%. It's nonsense. Start every long journey with 100%.

ABRP is conservative in my experience. I would guess the truck only needs a single 25-30 minute stop. If you get 2.2 miles per kWh, you'd need a total of 155 kWh. Start with 100% in an R1S with Large Pack (135 kWh). Drive an average of 65 mph (73 mph on the freeway} for 3 hours to go 195 miles, using 89 kWh. You have 56 kWh, 34% left. Charge to 80%, adding 62 kWh (46%) to the battery. If you get an average of 150 kW charge rate, that's 25 minutes. Maybe you get 120 kW average for a 31 minute stop.

You have 342-195=147 miles to go. The truck has 80% charge or 108 kWh. Using 2.2 miles/kWh efficiency, you use 67 kWh, leaving you with 41 kWh or 30% battery remaining.

Unless you drive faster or somehow you get less than 2.0 miles/kWh, I don't think the truck needs a second stop. But if you need a second stop, you might as well charge.
That’s exactly what it’s doing is starting at 90% and has 2 shorter stops where you only charge to about 60% or so. What you are saying makes more sense. I’ll play around with the app. Thanks!
 
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That’s exactly what it’s doing is starting at 90% and has 2 shorter stops where you only charge to about 60% or so. What you are saying makes more sense. I’ll play around with the app. Thanks!
There a philosophical conversation about which way people prefer: more, shorter stops or fewer, longer stops. This is entirely a personal preference thing.

It's objectively true that most EVs slow their charge rate at 80% and higher while on a DCFC. So when on a road trip, don't try to charge higher than that unless you have a good reason. Or you got busy enjoying your stop and forgot you were supposed to be in a hurry.
 
There a philosophical conversation about which way people prefer: more, shorter stops or fewer, longer stops. This is entirely a personal preference thing.

It's objectively true that most EVs slow their charge rate at 80% and higher while on a DCFC. So when on a road trip, don't try to charge higher than that unless you have a good reason. Or you got busy enjoying your stop and forgot you were supposed to be in a hurry.
By the way I may have to make some extra stops at the trucks stops along the way in an EV if the EV stop doesn’t have key chains. When we go on a trip I buy a key chain from every state and hook them together. It’s reminds me of all the places we go.

This was from our big trip to California and back in 2023.
IMG_5891.jpeg
 
This is a satirical, yet mostly accurate review of having to rent a gas-fueled vehicle for a week after years of mostly EV only driving…

I recently was on travel and the car rental place didn't have any normal cars, so I had to rent a gas vehicle. I figured it couldn't be that hard; lots of people do it.

When we picked it up, the first thing I noticed right away is that it doesn't have a frunk. Under the front compartment lid is just a big mess of dirty, greasy wires, tubes, aluminum, and other stuff. I would not enjoy working on something so complicated. Fortunately it's not mine. Just a rental.

And no frunk! What modern vehicle doesn't have a frunk!? I know, there are several. But, still. Where am I supposed to put my luggage? My sandy clothes? I packed stuff into the back compartment.

I got in and pressed the start button. The whole vehicle shuddered for a couple of seconds. I worried it was going to fall apart like in the old silent moving pictures. After a couple of seconds, the shuddering stopped and the vehicle started humming. Not only could you hear it, you could feel it. A gauge on the dash spun up, then settled down to a low number, but not zero. Great, it works. That full vehicle hum won't be too bad. I turned on the AC (physical control! Yay!) and the vents started blowing cold-ish air.

It took us a couple of seconds to figure out how to connect our phone and to program the navigation to take us where we were going. Fortunately the truck has Android Auto, so it wasn't too difficult.

I then spent several minutes trying to figure out where the seat back adjustment is. Turns out it's a strap! How retro! I had to get out of the truck to find that strap on the side of the seat. I got back in the truck, adjusted the mirrors, and checked that we were ready to go. Passengers ready.

I looked at the vehicle’s indicators. The little gauge indicated it was at 0 rpm, which seemed weird. I thought it was running. Press the start button again. It was not happy about that! I found out later, after being surprised by it several times, that the truck shuts off its power plant when it idles for too long. Great! That makes sense. I guess if I’d researched the vehicle a bit before we got here, I might have known.

I put it in drive, and started to pull out of the parking spot. Oh, goodness, this handles weird. The background hum becomes more of a roar. There’s a weird clunk every so often when the vehicle is accelerating and the roar becomes a hum again. Then it builds up to a roar. Weird. Not sure I’m going to like that.

As we were pulling onto the main road, I looked down at the dash and noticed that the energy indicator was at only 25%, which, fine, I guess—we’ll return it with a similar amount. The range estimator said 80 miles range, so I started looking for a refueling station. There was a sketchy one across and down the street from the rental place. I wasn’t excited about using it, but I wasn't sure where the next one would be, so I stopped there.

It took a few tries to figure out how to get the truck refueled. Apparently there are two major different kinds of fuel for gas vehicles. One with a green handle and one with a black handle. And you have to get the right one for your vehicle or you can destroy the vehicle. But they’re both offered at the same fueling station and even on the same fueling post. There was nothing obvious on the dash or at the plug that said which one I was supposed up use. One plug (the green one) didn't fit, so it was obviously not that one. The other plug fit. But it had another three options. I just went with the cheapest---hey, it's a rental. It’s very weird that you have to know and memorize what kind of energy is compatible with your vehicle, though.

Anyway, I plugged it in and nothing happened. I realized I had to choose the right type, so I did that (the cheapest). But still it didn't start fueling. I found a lever on the plug that goes into the vehicle and pulled it... And still nothing happened. The screen was asking me for my loyalty card. Skipped that. Then it asked me for my credit card. It's not just Plug and Charge! I swiped my credit card. It took a minute to approve it, but finally it told me I could dispense the fuel. There's a lever on the refueling plug that you have to hold down to charge refuel and you can't just start it and go to the restroom. Fortunately I had gone at the airport. But I still couldn’t just leave it. I had to stand there and breathe in the awful-smelling fuel instead of going to the restroom. What a pain.

Anyway, about ten minutes after stopping, we had 100% fuel. It cost $55!!! That's 10x what it costs to charge our battery from 0% to 100%.

I disconnected the refuel plug, hung it back up, and the machine printed a paper receipt. Weird. Got in the truck and pressed the start button. It roared and then hummed. I looked down at the instrument cluster and noticed that it was back up to 100% and it was claiming 320 miles of range. That’s the same range as my truck.

I put it into drive and headed onto the highway.

This thing handles like…well, not well. It weaves all over the place. Its power plant noise grows to a roar, then the vehicle shudders and a weird clunk happens and the roar dies back down to a hum and starts climbing again.

There’s no one-pedal drive. Not only that, there’s no regeneration. You have to use the friction brakes. Which squeal when they get wet.

There’s no regeneration! Can you believe that?! Not only is the fuel for this thing super expensive, you can’t even recover any when slowing down. Whenever it’s on, it’s burning the fuel (except when it shuts itself off at a stop light and you don’t know if it’s just quit or is saving fuel). Seems very wasteful.

Anyway, we drove the 10 miles to the hotel, all the while marveling at the weird design decisions: No 1-pd; no regeneration; very, very noisy; clunky-jerky behavior when the roar dies down to a hum; squealing friction brakes. Oh, and taking your foot off the accelerator doesn’t turn on your brake lights either. I found that out when the person behind me got super close. I guess that’s okay because it doesn’t use 1-pd and so the truck just kind of keeps rolling along when it should slow down significantly.

Got to the hotel and looked for the place to refuel. We didn’t need a lot, but I always try to refuel overnight. The hotel doesn’t have a Level 2 refueling option.

I looked it up later. Apparently the fuel is so toxic and dangerous that it’s heavily regulated and can only be dispensed at specific locations. Hotels are typically not certified to dispense the fuel. In fact, it’s also generally not possible to have a home refueling station. You always have to go refuel at one of these special, but sketchy stations. I don’t know how anyone can stand that. Can you imagine using an energy source that’s so dangerous that it’s regulated so heavily that you cannot generate your own at home? But this stuff really is dangerous and I understand why it has to be regulated.

I’m happy I have a roof that uses sunlight to create my vehicle’s energy.

Anyway, we drove around the next several days. Still trying to get used to the noise and bad handling of the vehicle. One night, we had to rush to the other side of the island we were on to catch a short-lived geological event. There was some major concern among my passengers that we wouldn’t be able to make it if we didn’t find a place to refuel. I briefly tried to figure out where the refueling stations are. Google has many of them in their database. And there are a lot more than I expected. But then I looked at the range estimate and if it was accurate, we wouldn’t need to refuel. So we went for it. I wasn’t interested in going to one of those stations at night, so was grateful we had enough to make it.

On the other side of the island, our hotel again didn’t have an overnight refueling station. I can’t believe how inconvenient this is! The next morning, we had to make a special trip just to find a refueling station. Unlike on PlugShare, you can’t generally see the prices on an app, so we had to drive past several before we were able to find one that was almost affordable. It cost another $50 to refuel! I still can’t believe how expensive it is. We drove about 500 miles over the course of the week. The cost was a little over $200 to drive those 500 miles. With the lightning, I can drive 500 miles for about $7.00 when charging at home and about $70-$90 when on road trips if I charge at expensive fast chargers.

Anyway, I was happy to return the vehicle and get back to my truck. I know this is likely not representative of every gas vehicle, but after driving this Jeep, I’m certain I don’t want a gas vehicle. They're smelly, loud, expensive to drive, handle like crap, use toxic fuels. And they’re noisy. Did I mention how noisy they are? There’s no regenerative braking—which just seems so wasteful, especially considering the cost of fuel. The infotainment tech was from the mid 2010s. I did not enjoy driving it at all.

I don’t really know what the benefits are. I guess if you got a much larger tank you could go a longer distance, but the cost of the fuel is so high it doesn’t make sense to me. There are a lot more refueling stations, but so many of the ones we saw were super sketchy, weren’t associated with places to eat—they were just kind of islands unto themselves. They really didn’t have much to recommend them. And the one where I used the restroom was so very gross.

Overall: Two thumbs down. Would not recommend.

View attachment 6778
This is so helpful. Your adventures seem exciting and this one sounds very memorable.
 
I downloaded APRB and put in a Rivian but honestly may not have picked what’s comparable to a Scout because they have all these different number of motors etc.

I missed the part about number of motors. I would guess you want to use 2 motors. but honestly the Terra and Traveler will be so similar that I think using the Lightning Extended Range (131 kWh) will be fine for estimating either. Basically what they’re using the vehicle selection for is the estimated efficiency and battery size. They’re not doing any sort of behind-the-scenes modeling of the vehicles and their air resistance, for example.

You can bypass much of that by changing the efficiency estimate used by ABRP. They use Wh/mile instead of miles/kWh. To convert, divide 1000 by the number you have.

1000 / 2.2 miles/kWh = 455 Wh/mile
1000 / 455 Wh/mile = 2.197 miles/kWh.
 
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I missed the part about number of motors. I would guess you want to use 2 motors. but honestly the Terra and Traveler will be so similar that I think using the Lightning Extended Range (131 kWh) will be fine for estimating either. Basically what they’re using the vehicle selection for is the estimated efficiency and battery size. They’re not doing any sort of behind-the-scenes modeling of the vehicles and their air resistance, for example.

You can bypass much of that by changing the efficiency estimate used by ABRP. They use Wh/mile instead of miles/kWh. To convert, divide 1000 by the number you have.

1000 / 2.2 miles/kWh = 455 Wh/mile
1000 / 455 Wh/mile = 2.197 miles/kWh.
You people and your math! 😹

Thank you very much for all the help!!
 
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This is a satirical, yet mostly accurate review of having to rent a gas-fueled vehicle for a week after years of mostly EV only driving…

I recently was on travel and the car rental place didn't have any normal cars, so I had to rent a gas vehicle. I figured it couldn't be that hard; lots of people do it.

When we picked it up, the first thing I noticed right away is that it doesn't have a frunk. Under the front compartment lid is just a big mess of dirty, greasy wires, tubes, aluminum, and other stuff. I would not enjoy working on something so complicated. Fortunately it's not mine. Just a rental.

And no frunk! What modern vehicle doesn't have a frunk!? I know, there are several. But, still. Where am I supposed to put my luggage? My sandy clothes? I packed stuff into the back compartment.

I got in and pressed the start button. The whole vehicle shuddered for a couple of seconds. I worried it was going to fall apart like in the old silent moving pictures. After a couple of seconds, the shuddering stopped and the vehicle started humming. Not only could you hear it, you could feel it. A gauge on the dash spun up, then settled down to a low number, but not zero. Great, it works. That full vehicle hum won't be too bad. I turned on the AC (physical control! Yay!) and the vents started blowing cold-ish air.

It took us a couple of seconds to figure out how to connect our phone and to program the navigation to take us where we were going. Fortunately the truck has Android Auto, so it wasn't too difficult.

I then spent several minutes trying to figure out where the seat back adjustment is. Turns out it's a strap! How retro! I had to get out of the truck to find that strap on the side of the seat. I got back in the truck, adjusted the mirrors, and checked that we were ready to go. Passengers ready.

I looked at the vehicle’s indicators. The little gauge indicated it was at 0 rpm, which seemed weird. I thought it was running. Press the start button again. It was not happy about that! I found out later, after being surprised by it several times, that the truck shuts off its power plant when it idles for too long. Great! That makes sense. I guess if I’d researched the vehicle a bit before we got here, I might have known.

I put it in drive, and started to pull out of the parking spot. Oh, goodness, this handles weird. The background hum becomes more of a roar. There’s a weird clunk every so often when the vehicle is accelerating and the roar becomes a hum again. Then it builds up to a roar. Weird. Not sure I’m going to like that.

As we were pulling onto the main road, I looked down at the dash and noticed that the energy indicator was at only 25%, which, fine, I guess—we’ll return it with a similar amount. The range estimator said 80 miles range, so I started looking for a refueling station. There was a sketchy one across and down the street from the rental place. I wasn’t excited about using it, but I wasn't sure where the next one would be, so I stopped there.

It took a few tries to figure out how to get the truck refueled. Apparently there are two major different kinds of fuel for gas vehicles. One with a green handle and one with a black handle. And you have to get the right one for your vehicle or you can destroy the vehicle. But they’re both offered at the same fueling station and even on the same fueling post. There was nothing obvious on the dash or at the plug that said which one I was supposed up use. One plug (the green one) didn't fit, so it was obviously not that one. The other plug fit. But it had another three options. I just went with the cheapest---hey, it's a rental. It’s very weird that you have to know and memorize what kind of energy is compatible with your vehicle, though.

Anyway, I plugged it in and nothing happened. I realized I had to choose the right type, so I did that (the cheapest). But still it didn't start fueling. I found a lever on the plug that goes into the vehicle and pulled it... And still nothing happened. The screen was asking me for my loyalty card. Skipped that. Then it asked me for my credit card. It's not just Plug and Charge! I swiped my credit card. It took a minute to approve it, but finally it told me I could dispense the fuel. There's a lever on the refueling plug that you have to hold down to charge refuel and you can't just start it and go to the restroom. Fortunately I had gone at the airport. But I still couldn’t just leave it. I had to stand there and breathe in the awful-smelling fuel instead of going to the restroom. What a pain.

Anyway, about ten minutes after stopping, we had 100% fuel. It cost $55!!! That's 10x what it costs to charge our battery from 0% to 100%.

I disconnected the refuel plug, hung it back up, and the machine printed a paper receipt. Weird. Got in the truck and pressed the start button. It roared and then hummed. I looked down at the instrument cluster and noticed that it was back up to 100% and it was claiming 320 miles of range. That’s the same range as my truck.

I put it into drive and headed onto the highway.

This thing handles like…well, not well. It weaves all over the place. Its power plant noise grows to a roar, then the vehicle shudders and a weird clunk happens and the roar dies back down to a hum and starts climbing again.

There’s no one-pedal drive. Not only that, there’s no regeneration. You have to use the friction brakes. Which squeal when they get wet.

There’s no regeneration! Can you believe that?! Not only is the fuel for this thing super expensive, you can’t even recover any when slowing down. Whenever it’s on, it’s burning the fuel (except when it shuts itself off at a stop light and you don’t know if it’s just quit or is saving fuel). Seems very wasteful.

Anyway, we drove the 10 miles to the hotel, all the while marveling at the weird design decisions: No 1-pd; no regeneration; very, very noisy; clunky-jerky behavior when the roar dies down to a hum; squealing friction brakes. Oh, and taking your foot off the accelerator doesn’t turn on your brake lights either. I found that out when the person behind me got super close. I guess that’s okay because it doesn’t use 1-pd and so the truck just kind of keeps rolling along when it should slow down significantly.

Got to the hotel and looked for the place to refuel. We didn’t need a lot, but I always try to refuel overnight. The hotel doesn’t have a Level 2 refueling option.

I looked it up later. Apparently the fuel is so toxic and dangerous that it’s heavily regulated and can only be dispensed at specific locations. Hotels are typically not certified to dispense the fuel. In fact, it’s also generally not possible to have a home refueling station. You always have to go refuel at one of these special, but sketchy stations. I don’t know how anyone can stand that. Can you imagine using an energy source that’s so dangerous that it’s regulated so heavily that you cannot generate your own at home? But this stuff really is dangerous and I understand why it has to be regulated.

I’m happy I have a roof that uses sunlight to create my vehicle’s energy.

Anyway, we drove around the next several days. Still trying to get used to the noise and bad handling of the vehicle. One night, we had to rush to the other side of the island we were on to catch a short-lived geological event. There was some major concern among my passengers that we wouldn’t be able to make it if we didn’t find a place to refuel. I briefly tried to figure out where the refueling stations are. Google has many of them in their database. And there are a lot more than I expected. But then I looked at the range estimate and if it was accurate, we wouldn’t need to refuel. So we went for it. I wasn’t interested in going to one of those stations at night, so was grateful we had enough to make it.

On the other side of the island, our hotel again didn’t have an overnight refueling station. I can’t believe how inconvenient this is! The next morning, we had to make a special trip just to find a refueling station. Unlike on PlugShare, you can’t generally see the prices on an app, so we had to drive past several before we were able to find one that was almost affordable. It cost another $50 to refuel! I still can’t believe how expensive it is. We drove about 500 miles over the course of the week. The cost was a little over $200 to drive those 500 miles. With the lightning, I can drive 500 miles for about $7.00 when charging at home and about $70-$90 when on road trips if I charge at expensive fast chargers.

Anyway, I was happy to return the vehicle and get back to my truck. I know this is likely not representative of every gas vehicle, but after driving this Jeep, I’m certain I don’t want a gas vehicle. They're smelly, loud, expensive to drive, handle like crap, use toxic fuels. And they’re noisy. Did I mention how noisy they are? There’s no regenerative braking—which just seems so wasteful, especially considering the cost of fuel. The infotainment tech was from the mid 2010s. I did not enjoy driving it at all.

I don’t really know what the benefits are. I guess if you got a much larger tank you could go a longer distance, but the cost of the fuel is so high it doesn’t make sense to me. There are a lot more refueling stations, but so many of the ones we saw were super sketchy, weren’t associated with places to eat—they were just kind of islands unto themselves. They really didn’t have much to recommend them. And the one where I used the restroom was so very gross.

Overall: Two thumbs down. Would not recommend.

View attachment 6778
Just wanted to say how inspired this writing was and how wasted it is as a forum post. This belongs in a magazine somewhere.