Solar Tonneau option

[philipsmithj]

Amonst the solar suggestions, I'm not seeing the suggestion of using the bed space on the Terra. A factory integrated solar tonneau or shell could basically provide off grid power. The huge attraction to this product aside from being American made is it's "multi-energy/fuel" options, especially for any off-grid, away from civilization activities. Not to mention, my car is all but forced to be outside the majority of daylight working hours. Why can't it charge without being tethered to a charging station? Looking at home panel standards by sqft, I'd bet there's around a 1Kw capacity if you could work out the roll or I guess in this case, stack away capability for when the height is needed for loads. Could it fold away between cab and bed or be at the front of the bed (it would need to be protected somehow). Solar paint and tint are very cool options, but seem very difficult from an engineering perspective. A solar sunroof or tonneau cover seem way more feasible. If you go with it, you *could* call it the Smith cover . (Microsoft has been commenting suggesters names into their code now for years. It's a good incentive for free suggestions) I'd definitely be a proud owner.

 

[cyure]

Amonst the solar suggestions, I'm not seeing the suggestion of using the bed space on the Terra. A factory integrated solar tonneau or shell could basically provide off grid power. The huge attraction to this product aside from being American made is it's "multi-energy/fuel" options, especially for any off-grid, away from civilization activities. Not to mention, my car is all but forced to be outside the majority of daylight working hours. Why can't it charge without being tethered to a charging station? Looking at home panel standards by sqft, I'd bet there's around a 1Kw capacity if you could work out the roll or I guess in this case, stack away capability for when the height is needed for loads. Could it fold away between cab and bed or be at the front of the bed (it would need to be protected somehow). Solar paint and tint are very cool options, but seem very difficult from an engineering perspective. A solar sunroof or tonneau cover seem way more feasible. If you go with it, you *could* call it the Smith cover . (Microsoft has been commenting suggesters names into their code now for years. It's a good incentive for free suggestions) I'd definitely be a proud owner.

Welcome to the community.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

Amonst the solar suggestions, I'm not seeing the suggestion of using the bed space on the Terra. A factory integrated solar tonneau or shell could basically provide off grid power. The huge attraction to this product aside from being American made is it's "multi-energy/fuel" options, especially for any off-grid, away from civilization activities. Not to mention, my car is all but forced to be outside the majority of daylight working hours. Why can't it charge without being tethered to a charging station? Looking at home panel standards by sqft, I'd bet there's around a 1Kw capacity if you could work out the roll or I guess in this case, stack away capability for when the height is needed for loads. Could it fold away between cab and bed or be at the front of the bed (it would need to be protected somehow). Solar paint and tint are very cool options, but seem very difficult from an engineering perspective. A solar sunroof or tonneau cover seem way more feasible. If you go with it, you *could* call it the Smith cover . (Microsoft has been commenting suggesters names into their code now for years. It's a good incentive for free suggestions) I'd definitely be a proud owner.

The SOLIS tonneau cover is such an offering. For an 8-foot bed, they suggest they can install a tonneau with 650 Watts of (ideal) power. To charge the vehicle they also need to have an auxiliary battery that powers a Level 1 EVSE. So the system works like this:

Solar —> Auxiliary Battery —> Level 1 EVSE —> Vehicle.

(Not coincidentally, this is how my system works, but I do my own solar instead of a tonneau cover.)

Ignoring losses, we can calculate how much an idealistic situation would work out:

In the United States, the average useful solar input is 4 hours per day. Obviously this is average, not every day. Some days will have more, some less. Some areas will have much more. Let’s use the national average of 4 hours per day.

650 Watts * 4 hours/day = 2.6 kWh / day.
365 days / year * 2.6 kWh / day = 950 kWh / year.

We expect somewhere between 120 and 180 kWh in the BEV. I think it’ll be closer to 150, but I don’t really know. I know they’ve said some numbers, but I’ll hold of on being certain. Let’s use 150 kWh.

949 kWh/year / 150 kWh/charge cycle = 6.33 charge cycles per year. ***for an 8-foot bed***
Assuming the 350 mile estimated range is accurate, that’s 2200 miles per year gained from the tonneau cover. ***for an 8-foot bed***
With a 5-foot bed, you get 5/8 or 63% of that. 6.33 * 0.63 = 4
63% of 2216 = ~1400 miles/year.

Cost considerations, if that’s the reason you would consider it:
Assume you’ll get a tonneau cover anyway, the decent ones are about $1500.
The SOLIS isn’t in production yet, but I would look at Telo’s suggested price for their factory-provided solar tonneau cover, which is $1500 more than the non-solar version. The bed is 60” long and 73” wide, so slightly smaller than the Terra’s bed. Let’s round up to $2000 (more) for the solar tonneau vs the non-solar tonneau. However, that doesn’t include the cost of the battery. Add another $2k for that.

For the first year, you pay $2.85/mile gained (in somewhat ideal conditions for the average US resident). But after the second year, the cost of the tonneau cover drops to ~$1.40/mile. After the 10th year, it drops to $0.29/mile. This is significantly more expensive energy than what you usually get. I pay about $0.02/mile for my Lightning when using grid power at home.
I don’t think the SOLIS auxiliary battery is close to the right size and would upsize to at least 5 kWh, so that would add cost.

Some people would argue that’s not worth the cost. Of course, some of those people would spend $5k on wheels and tires upgrades that they’ll never make use of or some people will spend $10k on an extended range battery but won’t take the truck on a road trip. What you spend your money on is up to you, so I wouldn’t let people use the cost argument to dissuade you from getting what you want to get—unless they know your financial situation and you’re planning something truly foolish.

I use my system to extend the range while I’m camping. I can get about 30-50 miles extra range—depending on the specifics—while boondocking for a long weekend. This enables me to get to some of my favorite camping sites that are just out of range of my 320 mile Lightning. But I’m in the US desert southwest where we get 8+ hours of good sun in the winter and 14 hours of good sun in the summer. It isn’t about cost, but about enabling something I enjoy doing: getting far from civilization. Even an extra 15-20 miles farther is a bonus and is worth it to me.

 

[BeerParty]

Amonst the solar suggestions, I'm not seeing the suggestion of using the bed space on the Terra. A factory integrated solar tonneau or shell could basically provide off grid power.

There are good reasons for not adding solar panels to electric vehicles. For details, I will refer you to two YouTubers with much better explanations that I could provide:

• Undecided with Matt Ferrell:
• Out Of Spec BITS:

If you are still interested in adding solar panels to your EV, I think something like the GoSun solution would be better for you.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

There are good reasons for not adding solar panels to electric vehicles. For details, I will refer you to two YouTubers with much better explanations that I could provide:

• Undecided with Matt Ferrell:
• Out Of Spec BITS:

If you are still interested in adding solar panels to your EV, I think something like the GoSun solution would be better for you.

I really don’t like the integrated solar options. None of them are cost effective and none of them are long-term maintenance-free.

 

[dreamweaver]

Amonst the solar suggestions, I'm not seeing the suggestion of using the bed space on the Terra. A factory integrated solar tonneau or shell could basically provide off grid power. The huge attraction to this product aside from being American made is it's "multi-energy/fuel" options, especially for any off-grid, away from civilization activities. Not to mention, my car is all but forced to be outside the majority of daylight working hours. Why can't it charge without being tethered to a charging station? Looking at home panel standards by sqft, I'd bet there's around a 1Kw capacity if you could work out the roll or I guess in this case, stack away capability for when the height is needed for loads. Could it fold away between cab and bed or be at the front of the bed (it would need to be protected somehow). Solar paint and tint are very cool options, but seem very difficult from an engineering perspective. A solar sunroof or tonneau cover seem way more feasible. If you go with it, you *could* call it the Smith cover . (Microsoft has been commenting suggesters names into their code now for years. It's a good incentive for free suggestions) I'd definitely be a proud owner.

Scout. “People. Connections. Community. Authenticity." Welcome to the Scout community. Enjoy the ride.
Remember the built in search on the forums is a great place to start getting answers to your many questions.

 

[J Alynn]

Amonst the solar suggestions, I'm not seeing the suggestion of using the bed space on the Terra. A factory integrated solar tonneau or shell could basically provide off grid power. The huge attraction to this product aside from being American made is it's "multi-energy/fuel" options, especially for any off-grid, away from civilization activities. Not to mention, my car is all but forced to be outside the majority of daylight working hours. Why can't it charge without being tethered to a charging station? Looking at home panel standards by sqft, I'd bet there's around a 1Kw capacity if you could work out the roll or I guess in this case, stack away capability for when the height is needed for loads. Could it fold away between cab and bed or be at the front of the bed (it would need to be protected somehow). Solar paint and tint are very cool options, but seem very difficult from an engineering perspective. A solar sunroof or tonneau cover seem way more feasible. If you go with it, you *could* call it the Smith cover . (Microsoft has been commenting suggesters names into their code now for years. It's a good incentive for free suggestions) I'd definitely be a proud owner.

Welcome to the forum and thanks for posting. If you use the search button with key word tonneau you will find lots of additional discussions throughout this forum. Enjoy!

 

[J Alynn]

The SOLIS tonneau cover is such an offering. For an 8-foot bed, they suggest they can install a tonneau with 650 Watts of (ideal) power. To charge the vehicle they also need to have an auxiliary battery that powers a Level 1 EVSE. So the system works like this:

Solar —> Auxiliary Battery —> Level 1 EVSE —> Vehicle.

(Not coincidentally, this is how my system works, but I do my own solar instead of a tonneau cover.)

Ignoring losses, we can calculate how much an idealistic situation would work out:

In the United States, the average useful solar input is 4 hours per day. Obviously this is average, not every day. Some days will have more, some less. Some areas will have much more. Let’s use the national average of 4 hours per day.

650 Watts * 4 hours/day = 2.6 kWh / day.
365 days / year * 2.6 kWh / day = 950 kWh / year.

We expect somewhere between 120 and 180 kWh in the BEV. I think it’ll be closer to 150, but I don’t really know. I know they’ve said some numbers, but I’ll hold of on being certain. Let’s use 150 kWh.

949 kWh/year / 150 kWh/charge cycle = 6.33 charge cycles per year. ***for an 8-foot bed***
Assuming the 350 mile estimated range is accurate, that’s 2200 miles per year gained from the tonneau cover. ***for an 8-foot bed***
With a 5-foot bed, you get 5/8 or 63% of that. 6.33 * 0.63 = 4
63% of 2216 = ~1400 miles/year.

Cost considerations, if that’s the reason you would consider it:
Assume you’ll get a tonneau cover anyway, the decent ones are about $1500.
The SOLIS isn’t in production yet, but I would look at Telo’s suggested price for their factory-provided solar tonneau cover, which is $1500 more than the non-solar version. The bed is 60” long and 73” wide, so slightly smaller than the Terra’s bed. Let’s round up to $2000 (more) for the solar tonneau vs the non-solar tonneau. However, that doesn’t include the cost of the battery. Add another $2k for that.

For the first year, you pay $2.85/mile gained (in somewhat ideal conditions for the average US resident). But after the second year, the cost of the tonneau cover drops to ~$1.40/mile. After the 10th year, it drops to $0.29/mile. This is significantly more expensive energy than what you usually get. I pay about $0.02/mile for my Lightning when using grid power at home.
I don’t think the SOLIS auxiliary battery is close to the right size and would upsize to at least 5 kWh, so that would add cost.

Some people would argue that’s not worth the cost. Of course, some of those people would spend $5k on wheels and tires upgrades that they’ll never make use of or some people will spend $10k on an extended range battery but won’t take the truck on a road trip. What you spend your money on is up to you, so I wouldn’t let people use the cost argument to dissuade you from getting what you want to get—unless they know your financial situation and you’re planning something truly foolish.

I use my system to extend the range while I’m camping. I can get about 30-50 miles extra range—depending on the specifics—while boondocking for a long weekend. This enables me to get to some of my favorite camping sites that are just out of range of my 320 mile Lightning. But I’m in the US desert southwest where we get 8+ hours of good sun in the winter and 14 hours of good sun in the summer. It isn’t about cost, but about enabling something I enjoy doing: getting far from civilization. Even an extra 15-20 miles farther is a bonus and is worth it to me.

Well stated

 

[philipsmithj]

Welcome to the forum and thanks for posting. If you use the search button with key word tonneau you will find lots of additional discussions throughout this forum. Enjoy!

Yep, didn't see any with a cursory search discussing a solar T' cover.

 

[philipsmithj]

The SOLIS tonneau cover is such an offering. For an 8-foot bed, they suggest they can install a tonneau with 650 Watts of (ideal) power. To charge the vehicle they also need to have an auxiliary battery that powers a Level 1 EVSE. So the system works like this:

Solar —> Auxiliary Battery —> Level 1 EVSE —> Vehicle.

(Not coincidentally, this is how my system works, but I do my own solar instead of a tonneau cover.)

Ignoring losses, we can calculate how much an idealistic situation would work out:

In the United States, the average useful solar input is 4 hours per day. Obviously this is average, not every day. Some days will have more, some less. Some areas will have much more. Let’s use the national average of 4 hours per day.

650 Watts * 4 hours/day = 2.6 kWh / day.
365 days / year * 2.6 kWh / day = 950 kWh / year.

We expect somewhere between 120 and 180 kWh in the BEV. I think it’ll be closer to 150, but I don’t really know. I know they’ve said some numbers, but I’ll hold of on being certain. Let’s use 150 kWh.

949 kWh/year / 150 kWh/charge cycle = 6.33 charge cycles per year. ***for an 8-foot bed***
Assuming the 350 mile estimated range is accurate, that’s 2200 miles per year gained from the tonneau cover. ***for an 8-foot bed***
With a 5-foot bed, you get 5/8 or 63% of that. 6.33 * 0.63 = 4
63% of 2216 = ~1400 miles/year.

Cost considerations, if that’s the reason you would consider it:
Assume you’ll get a tonneau cover anyway, the decent ones are about $1500.
The SOLIS isn’t in production yet, but I would look at Telo’s suggested price for their factory-provided solar tonneau cover, which is $1500 more than the non-solar version. The bed is 60” long and 73” wide, so slightly smaller than the Terra’s bed. Let’s round up to $2000 (more) for the solar tonneau vs the non-solar tonneau. However, that doesn’t include the cost of the battery. Add another $2k for that.

For the first year, you pay $2.85/mile gained (in somewhat ideal conditions for the average US resident). But after the second year, the cost of the tonneau cover drops to ~$1.40/mile. After the 10th year, it drops to $0.29/mile. This is significantly more expensive energy than what you usually get. I pay about $0.02/mile for my Lightning when using grid power at home.
I don’t think the SOLIS auxiliary battery is close to the right size and would upsize to at least 5 kWh, so that would add cost.

Some people would argue that’s not worth the cost. Of course, some of those people would spend $5k on wheels and tires upgrades that they’ll never make use of or some people will spend $10k on an extended range battery but won’t take the truck on a road trip. What you spend your money on is up to you, so I wouldn’t let people use the cost argument to dissuade you from getting what you want to get—unless they know your financial situation and you’re planning something truly foolish.

I use my system to extend the range while I’m camping. I can get about 30-50 miles extra range—depending on the specifics—while boondocking for a long weekend. This enables me to get to some of my favorite camping sites that are just out of range of my 320 mile Lightning. But I’m in the US desert southwest where we get 8+ hours of good sun in the winter and 14 hours of good sun in the summer. It isn’t about cost, but about enabling something I enjoy doing: getting far from civilization. Even an extra 15-20 miles farther is a bonus and is worth it to me.

Would a custom solution (as opposed to 3rd party) be more fit and get a better yield, say you get closer to 800w. Also with a custom solution, why would there be more batteries when that's already part of the vehicle architecture? I would also say the biggest attraction is not the average day's worth of sun. Any off-gridding adventures I'd be planning would be in the warmer, sunnier months. That's more the point.

For me, the point wouldn't be "free miles" as in the math doesn't really work out, but rather miles without infrastructure dependency for remoteness and maybe... Using your math, that's me driving to work and home every day off of sun harvested power collected while parked with plenty to spare, so I guess I get to go to lunch too. (I'm less than ~7 miles a day round trip for work) No gas station, no power station, and other than the road, no infrastructure needed albeit for a small number of miles over the course of a year. Again it's more about freedom than "free" or cost savings.

 

[Jamie@ScoutMotors]

The issue for all car manufacturers is that the solar panels would have to widthstand tremendous abuse: mechanical automatic car washes, 120 heat and -30 cold, piles of snow building up, ice, slush, road salt, and on and on. As the panels degrade, they are less effective as well. Plus manufacturers would have to warranty it.

Not saying it isn't possible, but it has hurdles.

 

[R1TVT]

In the case of the terra, there is also the issue of removing the tonneau or retracting it... That means interconnectivity to power is a major engineering consideration with many connections and potential failure points (unless it was permanently mounted, which would make the bed of the truck a lot less useable and appealing.

This was discussed on the forum at length already - most people landed on this being a 3rd party / aftermarket decision for buyers. The juice isn;t worth the squeeze for OEM's IMHO.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

Would a custom solution (as opposed to 3rd party) be more fit and get a better yield, say you get closer to 800w. Also with a custom solution, why would there be more batteries when that's already part of the vehicle architecture? I would also say the biggest attraction is not the average day's worth of sun. Any off-gridding adventures I'd be planning would be in the warmer, sunnier months. That's more the point.

For me, the point wouldn't be "free miles" as in the math doesn't really work out, but rather miles without infrastructure dependency for remoteness and maybe... Using your math, that's me driving to work and home every day off of sun harvested power collected while parked with plenty to spare, so I guess I get to go to lunch too. (I'm less than ~7 miles a day round trip for work) No gas station, no power station, and other than the road, no infrastructure needed albeit for a small number of miles over the course of a year. Again it's more about freedom than "free" or cost savings.

You cannot feed DC solar directly to a DC vehicle battery unless you have the right voltage. In the case of most vehicles, that's ~400 volts. In the case of Scout, we're hoping that's 800+ volts. To convert from the 12-48 volts of solar, you have to either have a DC-DC step-up converter or you have invert to AC to power an EVSE. There aren't any publicly available/affordable portable solar DC-DC chargers (yet). For power stability reasons, inverting to AC means you have to have an auxiliary battery that buffers the low-amperage, highly variable nature of solar.

If the vehicle manufacturer includes a solar system with the vehicle, it'll most likely be a DC-DC step-up converter. All aftermarket solutions will go the route of AC with an auxiliary battery as I described earlier. There's no safe way for a consumer to tap into the high voltage system of an EV battery.

For commuting purposes, it would be less maintenance and ultimately cheaper for you to install solar at home to offset the energy cost of your driving. Even if you "only" install a few kW, that would offset the power you use while commuting and then some. Since you're only 7 miles from home, a 2 mi/kWh vehicle would use 7 kWh (8-14 kWh with a lunch). You can offset that with a 2 kW solar system. That's small enough you might want to upgrade to a 5 kW system for basically just the cost of materials. If you don't want to involve the regulatory bodies, you can install that without connecting to the grid. You would charge a standalone battery and discharge it into the truck when you're home from your commute.

I fully agree with you about freedom from infrastructure. I have EVs for several reasons. One big reason is I get to make my own "fuel" at home with a 14.5 kW solar array, which keeps me at minimal to no grid use most of the year, including local driving and first and last legs of a road trip. I'm not subject to the whims of political shenanigans or corporate greed. Unfortunately, physics dictates that there's no way for me to avoid the infrastructure while on a normal road trip.

 

[Murraypetera]

I would be garage primary for home and work but would be happy to pay for solar for the edge cases like camping.

 

[R1TVT]

I would be garage primary for home and work but would be happy to pay for solar for the edge cases like camping.

Exactly, and edge cases are best supported in the aftermarket. Plenty of solar solutions there, or solutions that could be DIY.

 

[cyure]

I would be garage primary for home and work but would be happy to pay for solar for the edge cases like camping.

I have a question. How often do you go camping? How long is your average camping trip? How long is your longest camping trip? I’m just curious how often people are running into these edge case scenarios. Thanks!

 

[dreamweaver]

I have a question. How often do you go camping? How long is your average camping trip? How long is your longest camping trip? I’m just curious how often people are running into these edge case scenarios. Thanks!

No, 0, 0.

 

[cyure]

No, 0, 0.

Ha same! My Scout will be my pavement princess to replace my pavement princess Wrangler.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

I have a question. How often do you go camping? How long is your average camping trip? How long is your longest camping trip? I’m just curious how often people are running into these edge case scenarios. Thanks!

Not as often as I want, maybe 3-10 times a year. Prefer 10-20 times.
3-4 nights.
14 nights, but would go longer if I could be done with this whole "job" malarky.

 

[J Alynn]

No, 0, 0.

Same. Most I’ll tow is a utility trailer to drop off yard waste and landscaping clean up. But I know lots of people who camp though most are campground folks with full hook-ups.