Possible competition?
- Thread starter HKsMike
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Ford has more than likely been working on this for years now. The technology has been around for a while and is popular in other parts of the world. Jeep and Ram have already announced EREV models as well.
So have a few others.
18 Range-Extender (EREV) vehicles expected in the U.S. (2025-2028)
An Extended Range Electric Vehicle (EREV) is different to a PHEV where it’s primarily electric, but the engine acts as a generator to extend range. Here are 18 expected EREVs in the U.S.
topelectricsuv.com
Anyone else putting the generator in the back? Love the frunk, and with the spare tire on the back of the Traveler, it's a great use of space underneath.So have a few others.
18 Range-Extender (EREV) vehicles expected in the U.S. (2025-2028)
An Extended Range Electric Vehicle (EREV) is different to a PHEV where it’s primarily electric, but the engine acts as a generator to extend range. Here are 18 expected EREVs in the U.S.
A few are leaving the ICE up front. At least
the first comment I saw under that TFL video was someone saying they preferred the lightning as a full electric and mentioned something about the frunk. The only reply to it was the frunk will be lost for the engine, purely based on what ram has decided to do. It makes sense to leave the engine under the hood, but surely a well designed. EREV could still accommodate having a frunk
We dont need to worry about stellantis, those have about another 13 years of delays.So have a few others.
18 Range-Extender (EREV) vehicles expected in the U.S. (2025-2028)
An Extended Range Electric Vehicle (EREV) is different to a PHEV where it’s primarily electric, but the engine acts as a generator to extend range. Here are 18 expected EREVs in the U.S.
My impression of the Ford Lightning (in terms of design & development) was that they intentionally short-cut the process by removing the engine (creating a frunk) and removed the drivetrain components to make room for stuffing a battery into a reinforced frame. In the short term, this was likely the fastest and easiest path to production. But I wonder what the result would have been if Ford had decided to start with an entirely clean slate? Either way, this seemed intentional and also part of their marketing with the Lightning.
Engineering and designing an entirely new platform costs a lot of money and takes more time. I wonder if Ford will just take the same approach (in reverse) with the EREV and just slap an engine back into the frunk space and keep the battery structure similar to how it is today (just smaller) and then fill the gap left by the smaller battery with a large gas tank for the EREV.
Ford could then very easily pivot back to a full BEV truck in the future. I mean, part of the selling point for the Lightning was to capture a more conservative/laggard-leaning audience that didn't want their F-150 to "look electric" or different from their beloved F-150
According to the article I read, Ford is not abandoning BEVs altogether, just the F150 Lightening. Ford will still have a car (the Mustang Mach-E) and will have a small BEV truck (the Maverick EV*) soon. It sounds like they are planning a large EREV truck targeting the folks that need a towing vehicle. So, they are targeting the same people that Ram is with their "Ram 1500 REV". My main issue with this announcement is that they had no dates for planned release. We have no idea if it is going to be 2 years or 10 years before this new EREV truck from Ford comes out.
Considering how many delays Ram has had with their EREV, it seems like getting an EREV to perform as a tow vehicle is harder than enyone thought. There have been EREVs (hybrids) of different types availalbe for years, so the basic tech is well known. Ford has likely been working on an EREV truck in some capacity for a while. The fact that they don't even have a potential release date makes me wonder just how difficult designing a towing EREV is.
* I call the new small BEV truck from Ford the "Maverick EV", since Ford has not given it a name yet. There is some speculation it will be called the Ranchero, but I doubt it.
Considering how many delays Ram has had with their EREV, it seems like getting an EREV to perform as a tow vehicle is harder than enyone thought. There have been EREVs (hybrids) of different types availalbe for years, so the basic tech is well known. Ford has likely been working on an EREV truck in some capacity for a while. The fact that they don't even have a potential release date makes me wonder just how difficult designing a towing EREV is.
* I call the new small BEV truck from Ford the "Maverick EV", since Ford has not given it a name yet. There is some speculation it will be called the Ranchero, but I doubt it.
I was going to say they would likely just stuff an engine back under the hood since the whole thing with the Lightning was that it wasn’t a full clean slate design so it’s ready to accept an engine into the engine bay to fast track everything. R1TVT beat me to it though.
Yeah, it makes me a touch worried about towing with the Harvester which I plan to do.
The problem with EREVs is the masses don't understand them. Ford will have to spend millions on educating the public on what this system is and why it's a superior setup for truck use cases. That education will also help customers understand and maybe even consider Scout.
Honestly, EREV's have some of the same problems that EV's have regarding towing (or maybe different ones technically). If you want efficiency, you go with a small generator - Scouts plan. But that is not a great solution for towing, as you would be dipping into your battery too hard with a load on. If you go with a large engine, then you have added weight and need to find room for batteries - so the batteries (and weight and price) are what probably suffers the most (not really great if you want it to have a day job as an EV and a gas tow rig on the weekends).
The Maverick EV gets around most of this - as it is intended as a budget EV with a bed. I am kind of betting that Ford is hoping to do the EREV as a high end model. As their current higher end trucks are tagging 100k MSRP right now, I honestly don't see a great market for it at those prices - but I also don't see it likely if it will be much of a budget truck either.
The Maverick EV gets around most of this - as it is intended as a budget EV with a bed. I am kind of betting that Ford is hoping to do the EREV as a high end model. As their current higher end trucks are tagging 100k MSRP right now, I honestly don't see a great market for it at those prices - but I also don't see it likely if it will be much of a budget truck either.
The Maverick EV looks unlikely this decade. Right now 2.5L Hybrid or 2.0L EcoBoost only.
Ford has definitely lost me as a customer. I have no interest in a company that doesn't stand by its products or that only looks backwards.
The Mustang Mach-E was our first Ford in decades and the Lightning will be our last. The only problem we had with the Lightning was we don't need a full-sized pickup. Even if Ford releases a BEV Ranger or Maverick in two years, I can't trust that they will maintain its production for any reasonable length of time, so we will drive the Lightning until a reasonably-sized BEV replacement from a different company is available.
The Mustang and Lightning were both the best vehicles we'd ever owned and I would have recommended the vehicles to anyone for whom they fit. I can't recommend the company, though.
I sincerely hope Scout doesn't chicken out and retreat from the future. We're still thinking of the Scout Traveler BEV as a replacement for the Mustang, but only if it's a BEV.
The Mustang Mach-E was our first Ford in decades and the Lightning will be our last. The only problem we had with the Lightning was we don't need a full-sized pickup. Even if Ford releases a BEV Ranger or Maverick in two years, I can't trust that they will maintain its production for any reasonable length of time, so we will drive the Lightning until a reasonably-sized BEV replacement from a different company is available.
The Mustang and Lightning were both the best vehicles we'd ever owned and I would have recommended the vehicles to anyone for whom they fit. I can't recommend the company, though.
I sincerely hope Scout doesn't chicken out and retreat from the future. We're still thinking of the Scout Traveler BEV as a replacement for the Mustang, but only if it's a BEV.
Ford refreshes their models about every 5 years, with redesigns roughly every 10 years. The Lightning, first released in 2021, is right on track for a 5 year model line refresh. It's probably a fairly safe assumption that the Lightning EREV will have parts compatibility with current BEV Lightnings, at least for its electric drivetrain components. So what is the issue exactly?
Ford regularly switches up powertrains in their refreshes, sometimes adding and removing entire options. They are not "cancelling" the Lightning, they are switching it to an EREV powertrain. This in no way affects the truck you currently own and apparently love.
I think I agree with Space here. Sends a pretty clear message (and a WRONG message around delivering innovation around a pure BEV truck if you don't have one). My buddy just bought a Lightning and I think he is pretty bummed about this news too.
There's innovation and market realities, and given the poor sales of the Lightning and GM's offerings (Silverado/Sierra EV, and the Hummer EVs), the people that want and need full-size trucks aren't being properly served by BEV options. We're now seeing it in Ford backing off BEV, and Scout backtracking to add EREV options to their line-ups.
I get it, I've driven a Lightning, owned a PowerBoost for a while, the Lightning was a great experience, and I loved the PowerBoost. I still regret getting rid of it. If Scout wasn't on the horizon I might consider a Lightning, but I'd probably go with another PowerBoost because I need the range more than I need the "joy" of driving a BEV. Most of the people I know in similar situations feel the same.
It's just a fact of the current state of things that the market for full-size BEV trucks are a tiny minority.
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