Apple CarPlay ULTRA for Scout: A Game Changer for Infotainment?

[tuvok]

It would be amazing if Scout vehicles fully embraced Apple CarPlay Ultra and, eventually, Google's upcoming "ultra" version of Android Auto.

if you're unfamiliar with Apple CarPlay Ultra, Click here to read an article from MotorTrend. There is also a video in the article.

Let's be honest, car manufacturers generally s*ck at infotainment software that's as polished and user-friendly as what Apple and Google offer. It's a tough battle when you're going up against big companies whose sole focus is software and hardware development. Especially with the rapid integration of advanced AI into smartphones, there's no way car makers can realistically match Apple and Google in terms of cutting-edge intelligent feature integration in their vehicles.

Here's why I think this deep integration is so crucial:

Seamless Smartphone Integration

All of us carry iOS or Android smartphones. We're familiar with their interfaces, how they work, and what they can do. More importantly, our phones already know so much about us: our schedules, daily habits, appointments, preferred routes, and more. With CarPlay Ultra (and the equivalent Android Auto "ultra"), this familiarity and personalized information could seamlessly extend to our driving experience (without having to be transferred or shared with the car's software).

Imagine getting into your Scout, and your car's display immediately reflects your phone's familiar UI, apps, navigation, and even your calendar, all optimized for the driving environment. No more learning a completely new, often clunky, car-specific operating system. It's about eliminating that "dual digital personality" we currently experience in our cars. The cool thing is that the new CarPlay Ultra can even works with physical buttons in the dash!

Benefits for Scout and Us

While full integration might seem like giving up control, it actually presents some significant advantages for both Scout and the customers:

• Customization and Brand Identity: Apple and Google are already working with automakers to allow for customization of the interface, meaning Scout could still incorporate its unique design elements, like its distinctive horizontal speed gauge, while leveraging the robust underlying software.
• Engineering Focus: Instead of spending countless hours and resources reinventing the infotainment wheel from scratch (which usually never truly succeeds), Scout's engineers could focus their energy on other critical aspects of the vehicle – performance, safety, battery technology, and more features. This could lead to an even better overall vehicle.
• Potential Cost Savings: Since much of the computing power for the infotainment system would be handled by our powerful smartphones, it might reduce the need for expensive, high-end computer hardware within the car itself. Hopefully, any savings from this could then be passed on to us, the customers!

Ultimately, I'd love to see Apple CarPlay Ultra fully supported in Scout vehicles, allowing for a truly integrated and intuitive experience.

What are your thoughts on deeper smartphone integration like this?

 

[SrfnFly227]

My biggest reason for wanting Airplay is driving directions. Yes, modern vehicles offer maps and directions in the built in screens, but the user experience is lacking in my experience. Beyond that, I refuse to pay a manufacturer to update the database when I can just get directions on my phone from an app that updates a few times a year and even manages to give me the current speed limit. I don't need another redundant thing to pay for every year.

All that said, I don't have any desire for Carplay Ultra from what I've seen. I have no need to change the look of my instrument/gauge cluster.

 

[dreamweaver]

My biggest reason for wanting Airplay is driving directions. Yes, modern vehicles offer maps and directions in the built in screens, but the user experience is lacking in my experience. Beyond that, I refuse to pay a manufacturer to update the database when I can just get directions on my phone from an app that updates a few times a year and even manages to give me the current speed limit. I don't need another redundant thing to pay for every year.

All that said, I don't have any desire for Carplay Ultra from what I've seen. I have no need to change the look of my instrument/gauge cluster.

My current Lincoln allows me to change certain elements of the cluster, and I set up my look once and leave it. I think I will reserve judgment on Carplay Ulta until I see it in operation. As far as navigation goes I hope SM comes up with a great integrated system that takes advantage of personal phones, no one has done that yet. Otherwise wireless Apple CarPlay. I use CarPlay daily, it just works.

 

[Jkew]

Screens are the least important device in a vehicle, and fancy ones are used to justify data sharing agreements with third parties. The adventure should never in your entertainment system.

I expect protests and howls of “Luddite” but I expect all you will come around to this conclusion eventually.

 

[dreamweaver]

Screens are the least important device in a vehicle, and fancy ones are used to justify data sharing agreements with third parties. The adventure should never in your entertainment system.

I expect protests and howls of “Luddite” but I expect all you will come around to this conclusion eventually.

Life is an adventure of which everything you encounter matters, live deliberately.

 

[mastertroll]

Screens are the least important device in a vehicle, and fancy ones are used to justify data sharing agreements with third parties. The adventure should never in your entertainment system.

I expect protests and howls of “Luddite” but I expect all you will come around to this conclusion eventually.

I agree. At the same time I'm not complaining watching a movie with surround sound

 

[strider]

Please don't mandate Apple or Google crap. My car is one of the last places I can (sort of) escape the millstone that is my phone. The last thing I need is my car reading my text messages and emails to me. But if you want those things, just bluetooth your phone to your car and you can listen to whatever you want your phone to serve you.

Why would a manufacturer want the in-car experience to change depending on whether the driver has Google, Android, or no smartphone at all? Tesla does all of the phone integration I need while keeping the experience the same whether I am driving or my wife is driving. I can send addresses from my phone to the car, I can sync my calendar so it automatically knows where I need to go, etc. (I personally do not do any of those things but it works just fine).

Also, doesn't the manufacturer have to pay Apple and Google for that stuff? No thanks. Make it a paid upgrade for those who want it.

 

[Jamie@ScoutMotors]

Car Play and Android Auto are a support consideration because there are 4 billion phones out there and the average person spends 4 hours per day on their phone. If they want to continue/extend that use to their car, then we should support that. But if you don't want to use it, you don't have to.

 

[cyure]

Car Play and Android Auto are a support consideration because there are 4 billion phones out there and the average person spends 4 hours per day on their phone. If they want to continue/extend that use to their car, then we should support that. But if you don't want to use it, you don't have to.

I think that makes complete sense, I just wouldn’t want CarPlay Ultra. All the Scout software that has been shown looks amazing and I would like my Scout to have Scout software with the option to use CarPlay if I choose.

Plus I want that ribbon speedometer as a graphic option. I love that.

 

[dreamweaver]

I think that makes complete sense, I just wouldn’t want CarPlay Ultra. All the Scout software that has been shown looks amazing and I would like my Scout to have Scout software with the option to use CarPlay if I choose.

Plus I want that ribbon speedometer as a graphic option. I love that.

Yes that legacy analog speedo is cool as heck.

 

[cyure]

Yes that legacy analog speedo is cool as heck.

I love it. It’s SICK.

 

[dreamweaver]

I love it. It’s SICK.

And for the old guys "Sweet"

 

[cyure]

And for the old guys "Sweet"

This slightly older lady usually says amazing, but I’m branching out!

 

[oldgeeksguide]

Yes that legacy analog speedo is cool as heck.

OOohh, you mean speedometer! That makes much more sense now

 

[dreamweaver]

OOohh, you mean speedometer! That makes much more sense now

Yes. I wasn't talking bathing suits.

 

[jole]

I drive Rivian today. CarPlay Ultra would likely win me over to buy a Scout.

 

[cyure]

I drive Rivian today. CarPlay Ultra would likely win me over to buy a Scout.

Welcome to the community! We have some other Rivian drivers on the forum. You will be in great company.

 

[theonetruestripes]

My biggest reason for wanting Airplay is driving directions. Yes, modern vehicles offer maps and directions in the built in screens, but the user experience is lacking in my experience. Beyond that, I refuse to pay a manufacturer to update the database when I can just get directions on my phone from an app that updates a few times a year and even manages to give me the current speed limit. I don't need another redundant thing to pay for every year.

Indeed, that is a big use case for CarPlay, but EVs generally integrate charging and navigation. So having your phone plan a route means the phone might not know the battery state int eh EV so it can’t put charging stops in at the right locations for you. In addition if the phone does guess or otherwise know your battery state and add in charging stops for you the EV doesn’t know that you are planning on stopping at the Dunkin donuts to charge, you might just be driving along I9 in the general direction of that Dunkin Donuts, (that has an EV charger) so it won’t decide “hey, lets spend 3% of the battery’s power to heat the pack up to optimal fast charge tempature just in case we are stopping for a charge!” while if the EV planned the route it knows it is going to tel you to stop at the DD and it should preheat the battery.

So while I personally like CarPlay a LOT, and would prefer to have it. You probably want to try using the Scout’s own map service for directions (if it is Rivian’s system via the VWAGJV Rivian also does a lot of grading charge sites for reliability and speed and planning routes that don’t end up stranding you at a car dealership that has chargers but has them blocked during business hours or inaccessible after business hours!).

 

[dreamweaver]

Indeed, that is a big use case for CarPlay, but EVs generally integrate charging and navigation. So having your phone plan a route means the phone might not know the battery state int eh EV so it can’t put charging stops in at the right locations for you. In addition if the phone does guess or otherwise know your battery state and add in charging stops for you the EV doesn’t know that you are planning on stopping at the Dunkin donuts to charge, you might just be driving along I9 in the general direction of that Dunkin Donuts, (that has an EV charger) so it won’t decide “hey, lets spend 3% of the battery’s power to heat the pack up to optimal fast charge tempature just in case we are stopping for a charge!” while if the EV planned the route it knows it is going to tel you to stop at the DD and it should preheat the battery.

So while I personally like CarPlay a LOT, and would prefer to have it. You probably want to try using the Scout’s own map service for directions (if it is Rivian’s system via the VWAGJV Rivian also does a lot of grading charge sites for reliability and speed and planning routes that don’t end up stranding you at a car dealership that has chargers but has them blocked during business hours or inaccessible after business hours!).

Apple has said with CarPlay ULTRA you can do route planning with charging stops integration for EVs.

"Features of CarPlay Ultra​

• Real-Time Updates: CarPlay Ultra can provide real-time information about charging station availability and route adjustments based on battery levels.
• Enhanced Navigation: The system will suggest optimal charging stops based on the vehicle's current charge and the planned route."

 

[theonetruestripes]

It would be amazing if Scout vehicles fully embraced Apple CarPlay Ultra

Hmmm, I’m not so sure.

CarPlay is about getting phone stuff on your vehicle screen, and I’m 100% down with wanting that. Like my Rivian is in the shop, and my wife’s VW Golf has CarPlay, and I really enjoy that one part of driving the Golf. I mean I’m not enjoying pressing the gas and nothing happening for a long long time and then finally after an eternity the car starts to shake and slowly pick up speed and I accurately miss my “other 500HP”...and I parked it in the garage at 75% charge (er, gas), and the stupid thing was still at 75% two days later! It should be full!

But it does have CarPlay, so it tells me to turn “left at the next stop sign” not “in 300 feet”. It pauses my audibooks/podcasts rather then redoing their volume while talking over them for driving directions, and it does so many other nice little things.

So I’m utterly down with bringing all that stuff to the Scout.

CarPlay Ultra isn’t really about that, it is about having the car tell the phone “I’’m going 63MPH, why don’t you update the speedo!” and “left turn signal is on now, show that!”. So the phone can show that all in a uniform user experience that the auto maker (Scout) can customize and make their own...which if they didn’t have CarPlay Ultra is exactly what they are going to do anyway, they have some sort of Linux system with a GPU and some graphics libraries and the unreal 3D engine and all sorts of stuff to draw things, and they already have some layer of their own software stack that figures out they are going 63MPH that tells some other layer of their own software stack that they are going 63MPH, and if they have time they are going to customize that to look “Scout-ish”, maybe drawing a speedo that looks like a 1970s era Scout dashboard speedo with a big orange line over the current speed limit or something. Or if they don’t have time maybe it will look exactly like a Rivian and somewhat out of place in a retro-future Scout.

Doing it with Car Play Ultra means they can write some of that software again an second time and if someone plugs their iPhone in the iPhone can get involved in drawing the same stuff they would have drawn via Unreal or something else. It won’t save Scout any software effort because they have to account for “what if someone who buys the Scout doesn’t own an iPhone” so they will need to make sure all those displays work. Or “what if someone who does own an iPhone doesn’t plug it into the Scout every time they drive before they need to see their speed or anything!"

About the only “advantage” CarPlay Ultra will have is a slightly easier way to tell the phone “I have a big touch area over here, and a smaller display behind the steering wheel that you can draw on, but not sense touches, maybe a good place for turn by turn directions and a mini map, but put a second map off on the touch area!"

So from my point of view it would be great if Scout supports CarPlay. It would be slightly nicer if they support CarPlay Ultra, but from Scout’s point of view it would be at least 10x the work to support CarPlay Ultra. They would have to do most of the infotainment stack a second time. For a very modest set of additional features (and I believe CarPlay actually does support non-touch secondary displays along side the touch displays, it just is easier to describe to CarPlay Ultra).

I mean sure if they want to either hire a second engineer team to manage that, or to ditch half the features they have planned to make room for it with the existing manpower I’m not going to advise against it. Disclaimer: I use to work for Apple, and before working for Google interviewed at VW for the job of origin the infotainment stack. I didn’t take that job (I went to Google which may or may not have been a better choice), and I now run a small consulting company, so any answer of “Scout needs to do more work” could in theory mean I have another consulting client and make more money. ;-) So I really should be “all in” on “Scout should do more software work! More! More! Hire bigger teams! More features! Do it!"

In reality, I can’t say it is a good use of limited resources.

 

[theonetruestripes]

Apple has said with CarPlay ULTRA you can do route planning with charging stops integration for EVs.

Well that does change the value proposition of CarPlay Ultra, but maybe not by enough to make it worth all the extra work. I winder what a minimal CPU implementation would be. Like maybe keep doing your own display for the speed and everything, and use CarPlay Ultra just for the same sorts of displays you would use CarPlay for, but also do as much of Ultra as you need to get the EV routing integrated...